Your business in the Netherlands is up and running and even growing.
Congratulations, all that hard work is paying off.
Now you're ready for the next steps. But what does that mean?
Will you be hiring staff for the first time? Do you need to relocate?
Is the legal structure you've chosen still the right one for your company?
What about taxes?
And how to manage other business processes with a view to growth?
Do you have enough money for your future plans?
There are many questions. More than can be answered in one hour.
That's why we have our chat team in place.
You can pose your question through the chat function below your video screen.
We'll make sure you receive a response.
If not during this webinar then soon afterwards.
We will focus on four main topics in this webinar
for entrepreneurs in the growing phase of their business.
Legal structure, taxes, staff and financing.
We will discuss these topics with Johan Laffra
business consultant with the Netherlands Chamber of Commerce
and entrepreneurs Karim Sabri, founder and CEO of the platform Expat Republic
and Geta Rasciuc, founder and CEO of Babymoon. Welcome.
Johan, to start it off with you.
Entrepreneurs, when they start in general and have just kicked off their business
what in general should they be mindful of?
I think there are a lot of things that you need to be mindful of.
Once you actually start the business
there's all kinds of processes that you need to work with.
You need to know where you're going.
You need to keep your eye on the direction you want to go in with your business
but you need to set everything in place and in motion.
I think that's the most important step.
Get your clients, get your paperwork up and running
and start going in the direction you want to go in.
And what type of aspects come with that:
setting up your business and getting the legal work done?
Well, I think the most important one is setting up your taxes.
So at that point, get your money streams in order.
I think for most start-up companies, that's the most important part.
But once that's taken care of, then it's going to be doing the actual business
getting out there, get your name known, get your clients
and start doing what it is that you're good at doing.
Great. So these are all aspects that we will zoom in on later on in this webinar.
But first, let's meet our entrepreneurs. Welcome to both of you.
Geta, to start off with you, you have founded a really special company
around a special baby product.
Special baby carriers for especially small babies, if I remember correctly.
Could you elaborate? -It is a pretty niche business.
We're looking at really
changing the care approach to new-borns
to children actually in their first thousand days of life.
It's all evidence-based. And yeah, it started around a baby carrier
but it's actually a much larger angle towards what we're doing.
Maybe to explain it a bit more, we can watch this video you made.
Yeah, I think that would be easier for people to understand.
Hi, I am Geta. I am the founder of Babymoon Care
and we are working to change infant care to an attachment model all over the world.
I started as an entrepreneur overall in baby carriers.
It was 2006, I had my first son, so I started wearing my son.
I was in love with the concept of that.
And step by step, I would figure out all the benefits that brought to me.
2006 until 2010, I was just making baby carriers.
I wanted to not do the business, but then
the world told me like: No, we need you to do this.
That's when I started working with the maternity hospitals in Moldova
and working more on a system of care rather than just a device.
Babymoon is actually a much more complex system than just a carrier company.
I come from Moldova, I am in the Netherlands since 2016.
Since then there was a lot of groundwork covered.
And now we're working in the Scandinavian region and Benelux
and we have a big, important project coming up
with Tanzania and Kenya
and that's done together with the United Nations.
So we have a lot of stuff going on.
Back in the time when I came up with the concept, for me this was just fiction.
And here I am in the Netherlands
and here I am, connected by the Dutch entrepreneurial environment
to the United Nations.
And here I am making that fiction that I came up with
four years ago, a reality.
So that's mind-blowing to myself even. But aside from connections like this
you get really huge opportunities
and there are so many more doorways opened to build a global business.
So that's valuable.
Geta, how would you characterise the current state that your company is in
and in a nutshell, how did you get there?
In a nutshell, it took a lot of effort
and a lot of research and adapting to the environment where I ended up.
But the current state would be like
we're right about to take off. So that's pretty exciting.
That's super exciting. Congratulations.
And Karim, to introduce you, you have, if I remember correctly
an online platform for expats in the Netherlands
so they can connect to each other.
How would you describe your rise to the stage that your company is at right now?
Actually, it started off as a hobby just doing events and meetups for expats
because it's hard to move to a new country with no friends and no network.
It started to grow as a hobby and we started to do bigger and more events.
And then we became also more online, with the pandemic
and we have articles and webinars.
That's how we grew and we got a lot of attention and people started contacting us.
Amazing. Let's also watch your video.
I'm Karim Sabri, I'm from Canada and the name of my company is Expat Republic.
We are an English media company based in the Netherlands
and we provide content and events and knowledge for expats
to make their life fruitful and enjoyable
while they're in the Netherlands, to help them also grow their network.
In fact, it was a hobby.
I noticed that a lot of expats didn't have many friends, they didn't have a network.
So I stepped in and I enjoyed organising events
so I just started doing loads of events and meetups
to kind of help them not be lonely, essentially.
We try and cover all walks of life for expatriates and internationals.
So, for instance, we will have a Basics of Investing webinar.
We will have a seminar about buying your own home.
We will just do drinks, like super easy, just so people can meet and connect
and grow their personal and social network.
So you want to kind of give them that feeling of being at home.
The way we make money is very simple. It's a media company
the same way a magazine makes money: with advertising.
But the idea is it's a sort of smart advertising.
It's helpful, it's knowledgeable.
It's not inconvenient or intrusive.
We really like to transfer knowledge to our audience or transfer something nice
so they have a good feeling, right?
And so as a partner that will like to do that
to provide that to an international audience, we're the perfect vehicle.
So for me, the Netherlands is an incredible place to be an entrepreneur.
Loads of opportunities, easy to do business in
very direct, very honest, very straightforward.
Lots of opportunities, access to capital, access to labour force
a good system in place that makes doing business very easy.
And you can also do it in English.
Karim, are you also planning on professionalising your business further?
Of course, we're always looking to grow. We're already quite professional.
We're of course looking to grow and to expand to other European countries as well.
And are you also looking then to maybe turn it into a different legal structure?
Yeah, of course. That's probably something we should have done already
but everything has its time.
I just want to make sure that things are done in a structured way that works for us
and that we can continue to grow with a good foundation properly.
So you are indeed looking to see maybe if you can change that.
Because when starting a business, also growing a business
that legal structure can change.
So that's a really important aspect that we will also dive into later on in this webinar.
Thank you so much. But maybe before we dive into that deeper
Johan, could you explain to us
what different legal structures there are in the Netherlands?
There are quite a few legal structures that you can choose from.
I think the most well-known are the sole proprietorship
in Dutch called the 'eenmanszaak'
which is the legal form most start-up businesses choose when they register.
But there are legal structures for partnerships, that's also possible.
And you have the possibility to register a legal entity
the most common being the liability company, the BV.
What is the main difference then between a sole proprietorship and a BV?
I think there are two. They're different when it comes to liability.
As a one-man business, you're personally liable.
As a legal entity, you're not. So that's a huge difference.
On the other hand, when it comes to taxes
and you're a start-up business, you might benefit just a little more
from the sole proprietorship than you would as a legal entity.
So, when should you review your legal structure in that case?
I'd say that once you start growing
the business starts increasing, there's more money going around
your liability becomes a bigger issue
and you might want to start working with staff
all elements that increase your liability
that could be a point at which you make the change into a legal entity.
And I would also say, look at taxes.
Once you start paying too much taxes as a sole proprietor
I think that's going to be the cue from your accountant or your bookkeeper
to make the change into a legal entity.
So that, of course, would be a huge advantage to change.
Are there any other main advantages to switching to a BV?
Depends. If you go international, there could be an argument.
Being a director of a legal entity in foreign countries
is easier to explain than having a sole proprietorship.
That could be one. And I'd say if you start working with investors
then also a BV becomes more interesting
because you can have investors who can have shares.
And that's not possible if you have a sole proprietorship or a general partnership.
How should an entrepreneur know when their business would actually qualify as a BV
if it wants to take advantage of all of this?
I'd say that you'd normally have your accountant
who's going to look at your bookkeeping. They're going to give you a cue.
I'd say that if you want to work with investors and scenarios like that
you'll find out that that's the only possibility.
But keep in mind that it's not always necessary to change.
You can start off as a one-man business or general partnership
and change into a legal entity.
But there are also a lot of people who don't and who stay sole proprietors
or partnerships their entire business career.
Geta, you actually started as a BV.
Did you see that as an advantage? And why did you choose for that?
In my case, when I came to the Netherlands in 2016
I came as part of a business acceleration programme
and this was the structure that they advised us from the very start.
We actually have a holding company
owning the shares inside the BV
and then the investors come along and there's the whole stock.
So it's a bit more sophisticated structure.
Was it a good or a bad choice?
I'm not sure. It worked for me so far, so I can't complain.
So for you, it probably was a good choice. -Yeah, in some ways, yes.
And Johan, would you say that a transition to BV
is always a logical next step for sole proprietorship?
No. As I mentioned earlier, for some it is.
And I'd say based on the growing of your business and your liability increasing
and profit increasing, that could be a reason to change.
Having the investor on board could help making that transition.
But for some, it goes from a sole proprietorship to a legal entity
and for a lot of others it doesn't.
And they're going to stay the exact same way as they start now.
It's not mandatory. You don't need to go to a legal entity at some point.
There's a choice and the choice will depend on your specific situation
and your needs. -Exactly.
We will come to talk about the situation of a sole proprietorship and a BV
in the next chapter, for there's much more to this.
But first, let's continue with a bird's eye view
on the growing and expanding of your business.
Business is going well for Mike. He wants to expand. What are his options?
Should he expand his product range, hire staff, start trading internationally?
How about opening a branch office?
Expansion comes with risks and Mike needs to know what they are.
Is there a market for his new products?
Does he need extra insurance for international business or permits?
Mike needs a growth plan to help him focus.
He visits business.gov.nl, the point of single contact website
that offers entrepreneurs complete and up-to-date government information.
Here, he finds all he needs to know.
The market research he's done is the input for his marketing plan.
He knows which products show the most promise.
Research into the national and international market
has shown him where to focus his efforts.
Next, he has to think about promotion.
He needs to consider his target market to find the right mix
of traditional and online marketing tools.
Financing is an essential part of growing.
Now that Mike knows what he wants to do
he needs to decide how to finance the expansion.
Go for one source of funding or for a mixture.
Market research, marketing and finance.
Those are the ingredients for a growth plan that will work.
Mike knows how to move forward.
And so can you, with a little help from business.gov.nl.
Do you have general recommendations for businesses when they think of growing?
I think that it's... You'll be looking at
what your plans were right from the beginning.
I think that's a nice starting point.
Once you started your business, you had a plan, you had a vision
you had somewhere you wanted to go
and where you wanted to end up with your business.
I think it's always good to keep an eye on what your plans were.
Are you still on track? Are you still going in the direction where you want to go?
So for those who wrote a business plan
keep working with that specific plan.
Look at what you estimated on doing.
And on top of that, you'll be looking into possibilities of growth.
You might want to start writing a growing plan
saying: I'm here now. I'm still in line with what I intentionally planned.
But how am I going to go to the next step?
You'll be thinking about expanding product, expanding market.
You might want to look into hiring personnel
relocating, all that kind of stuff.
It's the next step and that's the thing that you'll be thinking of.
Exactly. So this growth plan actually is sort of key to first taking that next step.
What aspects would you deem most important to be named in this growth plan?
I'd say look at financing look at staff, maybe
look at your location, your legal structure, maybe.
I'd say that those elements are the things that you need to look into.
Sounds logical. Karim, growth plan, does that ring a bell?
Did you put anything on paper? -Of course I did.
But you always have to refine things.
That's about moving your business one per cent per day. That's my motto.
Any remarks to the growth plan that Johan just sketched?
Essentially, you do look at your growth plan. We do put things on paper.
We do take a look at: OK, what's the next logical step for us?
I'm not a fan of keeping things super rigid, right?
Because things always change on a day-to-day basis.
As long as the general direction doesn't change, I think you're good.
That sounds very logical. How do you make sure that everyone and of course you
are able to keep focus in that case?
It's very simple. You focus on your clients and in our case, focus on our audience.
So if you keep those two happy...
Keeping the focus is about keeping your customers
and your stakeholders happy, essentially.
And if you can do that, you're usually going to end up in the right way.
That sounds good. And in that case
are there also any special remarks for non-Dutch entrepreneurs?
Definitely. Well, the Netherlands is a really great place to do business.
I would say just know the regulations, get to know
what sort of company you want to start.
And basically... Because at the end of the day, a business is about
having customers. So find your first customers.
And it's quite easy to do in the Netherlands
just because of the business-friendly environment.
It's quite good, actually.
That's good to hear. -I hope that answers your question.
Yeah, definitely.
And now I would like to see what your strategy base is.
So I have a statement for you. -Sure.
In the running of your business, you should always go after opportunities.
Geta, to maybe start with you.
You should definitely seek opportunities, but you don't take all of them.
You take the ones that work for you
and are in line with your planning and your business directions.
Because otherwise you just waste effort and you're all over the place.
So who needs that when you want to build something specific, right?
Do you agree with that, Karim? -Absolutely.
Opportunities. It's always going for the right opportunities.
But I don't agree with being opportunistic.
You see what I mean? It has to match with your overall vision, absolutely.
And you, Johan, as a business consultant
do you agree with the statement? -Yeah, they're both right.
It has to work for your situation.
It needs to be you, your business, your planning.
You need to keep an eye open for possibilities
but in the end it needs to suit your business.
And they both make that happen. So, yeah, I totally agree.
They certainly do. So, Geta, looking at opportunities
what is your next step with Babymoon? -Well, right now
we have a lot of work on our plate
because we're literally in the middle of launching
in both our business directions
because we have a direction for the consumer market and one for the health.
So first of all, we have two parallel lines of work.
And the team is small enough at this point
so we can't afford looking for opportunities
that are not on our radar.
They may be great and amazing and fantastic
but right on this point of where our business is
we have to put value to all the prework that has been done
launch, get the goals that we were looking at.
And then after that, we can maybe take a phase of
searching for other opportunities
at a stage when we're kind of transitioning to another step.
Exactly, and I can imagine, especially with the team you're describing
financing and launching is really important in this.
But we can dive deeper into that later on. Great to hear that.
Karim, maybe a question for you again. What is at the top of your list
the first thing you do once you actually are a BV?
That's a good question.
It really doesn't change much, to be honest.
Because I'm going to do the exact same thing I do every morning.
I'm going to wake up and think about my customers
and the people I need to help.
So the legal structure is kind of a transparent thing.
And you probably want to just hand over all that accounting and tax stuff
to someone who knows what they're doing.
And of course, you can visit our website for those companies.
Good to mention. Thank you.
Let's summarise what we've discussed.
The big picture of running a business
and reviewing the legal structure because of the changes.
You should write a growth plan and try to keep the focus on where you're going.
You can find all the information you need on business.gov.nl.
Managing your growth means focusing on several aspects.
Taxes, for example. What changes in taxes when you become a BV?
We will also discuss the possibilities of hiring staff.
What type of employment suits your business best and what would change?
And we will take a look at financing.
What types of financing are there in the Dutch financing landscape?
We will discuss these topics with Johan Laffra of the Chamber of Commerce
and our entrepreneurs Geta and Karim.
With these different legal structures, there are different tax regulations.
How does that work differently?
I think for all legal entities
the one that you all have to work with is the VAT.
In Dutch called the BTW, the value added tax.
That's something that works for every legal entity.
The main difference is when it comes to income tax
versus the corporate tax.
That's the biggest difference between the personal entities
and the legal structures.
Does anything change in these taxes when you become a BV
compared to the other legal structures?
The one that isn't going to change is the VAT. That works the same for all of them.
The biggest difference is that once you have a one-man business
a general partnership or a professional partnership
you pay income tax over all profit.
And the difference with the legal entity, the BV
is that you'll be paying a salary
which should be what's normal in the market
but it needs to be at least 46.000 euros.
That's money that you'll pay your income tax over.
But on top of that, if there's more profit, you'll start paying your corporate tax.
And that's the biggest difference
between the personal entities and the legal structures.
Does that mean that if I would choose a BV, I would have to fill in two forms
both one for the income tax and one for the corporate tax?
It's going to be in two different tax systems, yes.
So it's in addition to just the income tax as a sole proprietor.
Well, that's good to know at least.
Are there also tax reductions that entrepreneurs can use?
Yes, those go for the one-man business and the partnerships.
If you meet certain criteria, you're entitled to all kinds of tax discounts.
Those discounts won't apply if you have a legal structure.
That's normally the reason why your profit needs to increase on an annual basis
before switching to a legal entity becomes interesting from a tax point of view.
So you would say that becoming a BV in a tax point of view
would be a disadvantage, but especially if you're making more profit
those will weigh up against each other. -That's true.
Are there any other deductions for the other legal structures apart from the BV
that these entrepreneurs could benefit from before?
I'd say that those are not part of the actual legal structure
but it depends on your activity.
Once you start doing something
there might be subsidies or research and development things
that you can use for your business.
But those don't solely apply to just the legal form.
It has to do with what it is that you're doing.
That sounds logical. -OK, that's good.
In that case, let's start talking about hiring staff.
Geta, do you currently employ staff?
Yeah, we have a team of eight right now.
Well, that's the executives and the office team.
Everyone is working on their own terms
because we're still fundraising at this point.
We have people who we hired for zero hours
and then they get paid per job...
Well, number of hours they actually put in.
But then there are people who are full time
and they are very important to us for growth.
And then there are people who we deal with externally
and just do contract basis.
So you actually have quite a few different ways of employment.
Karim, do you also have these different ways of employment?
Essentially, we work mainly with freelancers.
So writers, editors, marketeers, essentially.
And no one is employed by us. We just have freelance contracts with them.
I'm sure that has its advantages and different structures.
So maybe, Johan, you could enlighten us in the theory.
What kind of different types of employment are there in the Netherlands?
There are so many ways to employ people.
There's a scenario for each and every one.
But I think the biggest difference is: You can hire someone as an employee directly
so put them on your payroll and then start working from there.
I hear you saying something about zero hour contracts, which is fine too.
You'll still be their employer, but the amount of hours worked is a variable.
That's an option. You can hire people through temping agencies
through payroll organisations, and you can even hire independents
like freelancers or ZZP people.
That's all possible.
So you'll be looking at whatever works for you
and there's probably an option for that.
That's what entrepreneurs should always keep in mind.
What works best for me?
Maybe that's a great intro for the next statement I have for entrepreneurs.
The statement is: It is better to have fixed term contracts than flexible ones.
And I feel you might both have a different answer to that.
But, Karim, let's start with you.
I'm a big fan of flexibility, so
you know my answer. -I figured that would be the case.
Will that differ, maybe, when you become a BV in the future?
Yes and no. We just need to see how the growth plan goes
and what resources and skills we'll need.
It's all about what's available readily on the market.
So I can imagine that we will need that.
As the company grows, we will need new skill sets in the business.
That sounds logical.
And Geta, I believe from your story, you had several types.
It really depends on who we're talking with
and exactly what's the type of work that they are putting in.
Like, for example, when there are
things related to intellectual property
because we have a lot of innovation to what we're doing
so there are probably rigid terms that we would impose.
But on the other hand, having flexibility in our collaboration
with anyone who'd work with us, I think it's pretty important
because you can't just be a woodpecker about this.
Especially when you're talking about IP, it's really important, of course.
So there's not one which you particularly would prefer.
No, I mean, it's situational.
You have to adapt to the situation, to the task at hand.
So when you started Babymoon, in the beginning
did you start with the flexible ones or the fixed term ones?
When I started, I started with exploring where I landed
let's put it this way. And it took a while.
At that stage, there was a lot of
research and development done, by me mostly.
But then when I had to get people to do something for the company
then it would be a short term, like task-based agreement.
And it was limited.
Now, at the point when we have people on an ongoing basis
as part of the team and doing the Monday meetings and all of that
with a stable team, it's a bit different.
But still we keep the flexibility
and we still have people from outside the company also providing input.
So right now, it's a matter of managing what's on the inside
and then all those satellite supporters that we have.
It sounds like a colourful bunch together.
Do you have any advice for the entrepreneurs at home
how they could choose what would best suit their company?
I would think: Just to know exactly
the requirements they have for the people they hire
and based on those requirements, adapt the way they hire them.
I think that's good advice.
It's best to know what you want and upfront.
So then maybe a quick theoretical question for Johan again.
Can a sole proprietor also hire staff? -Yes, that's possible.
Is that possible in any legal structure?
The sole proprietor only says something about
the number of owners of the actual business.
So there's going to be one owner. As a partnership you'll have multiple owners
as a legal entity, both can apply.
But it only has to do with ownership
and both can have employees
in all scenarios that we just mentioned.
I can imagine when you actually employ these people on fixed terms
it will probably have financial consequences.
Could you tell us a bit more about that? -Once you hire someone
then they become your employee.
At that point, you need to set up an administration.
There are payroll taxes that need to be done, that need to be set in motion.
For some, it's fine to do it yourself.
I hear a lot of people saying that now I start working with personnel
the first thing I'm going to do is hire myself a bookkeeper or an accountant
to make sure that payroll taxes are taken care of the way it should be.
But yeah, in the end
you'll have to deal with employer stuff.
You touch upon a really important point there.
Because of course there are many regulations and rules around that.
So what would you say are the most important
employment contract terms and conditions
in the Netherlands that you should be aware of?
First off, it depends on the contract that you're going to set up.
Will you be setting up someone for 40 hours a week for the rest of their life?
That's a different scenario than when you start working with people
on a zero hour contract.
So that's the first thing that you need to look at.
What kind of agreement am I going to set up?
And once you do there's all kinds of stuff.
You'll be paying your employer wages for your personnel
the salary that's required.
Most of the time, people actually want to earn some money.
You'll be paying some benefits on top of that, as an employer.
So that's important.
But there are all kinds of...
Well, as I just said, there's the minimum wage to take care of.
You need to set something in place for holidays and stuff like that.
There's pension. There are insurances that need to be covered.
All those elements combined make the official contract.
That's quite a bunch of rules and regulations to be aware of.
Karim and Geta, any of these Dutch rules that we have here
did they come as a surprise? Were they different to what you were used to?
No. -I worked here already for a few years
so there was a lot of stuff that I knew about the system.
So it was a little bit easier for me in that sense.
And for you, Geta? -No.
These are all points that are valid and relevant wherever you do business.
So you have to keep all of that in mind.
On the other hand, if I compare
just the paperwork processes here, it is much less complicated
than in Eastern Europe, where I come from.
But then the fact that it's simplified
has to make you a bit more aware of what you're putting into that contract.
Because when you're just winging it
that's not a good idea ever.
So at times, it's actually good to have the possibility to have an adviser
to ask someone for their professional input
if you feel that you're not qualified well enough
to build the contract yourself.
Because sometimes you can just not be aware of some aspects
and then that can bite you later on.
It's good that you mention it. Because just to sort of close this off:
Are there any other aspects that an entrepreneur should know
when working with staff, Johan?
I'd say always start at the beginning.
As already mentioned by our two guests today:
What is it that you're looking for?
If you have a very clear picture of what the future is going to look like
it's going to be much easier to hire someone directly
for a longer period.
So look at the coming months
maybe the first one, two years.
See where you're planning on going. And based on that
you can make the right choice regarding your staff.
So have a clear picture. It applies to every segment today.
Have a clear picture of where you want to go.
Think about it and have a clear picture. And then you can start with your staff.
And I can imagine you have staff and your employees.
They have to work somewhere. Do you have an office space, Geta?
Yes, we do have an office space. I'm very excited about that
because we moved to the office just a few months back.
So it's really exciting that the people can come.
There is this point that a big part of our team works remotely
because they're not located in the Netherlands.
We have people in Switzerland, in Tanzania, in Moldova. So it's pretty international.
How did you find them, actually, if they're from all over the world?
It took a while. -Did you use LinkedIn?
Some people, yes. Someone actually I found on LinkedIn.
With others it was just a matter of
engaging the networks that I have.
So, well, me and then the other people involved.
And it doesn't have to be LinkedIn necessarily.
A network is a network. It's just human connection.
So that's the biggest part, probably. A good network.
And through that, find the right employees.
Is that the same way you do it, Karim, with your freelancers?
In some way, yes. The thing is, we already have a huge following.
I mean we have close to 110, 115,000 followers
that's expats living and working in the Netherlands.
So for us to recruit talent, we just use our own network.
Already people come to us and solicit us.
Hey, can I write for you? Can I work with you?
I've had that luxury, actually. So that's great.
And I have some incredible people on my team that I'm really proud of
and it's been really a nice journey.
So actually, once again it comes down to a network.
But in this case, the fact that everyone knows you.
'Luxeprobleem', as they say in Dutch.
Because, Geta, for you again with hiring staff
what are the most important aspects you look at when hiring a new person?
at this point of the development of the company
we're definitely looking at people who can deal with
uncertainty.
Uncertainty is not necessarily a 2020 thing.
Especially when you're dealing with start-ups and innovation.
We're looking at people who can self-organise
and can be goal driven.
That's probably a common denominator that we're looking at.
But then also having good background in the specific work that they are doing.
That's important. -That's really important.
Look what they've done and see if they can build on from there in your company.
I believe we've got quite a lot of tips for entrepreneurs regarding hiring.
So let's go to financing.
Could you elaborate on the types of financing there are in the Netherlands?
You can ask friends and family
I think that's the easiest one.
There are micro credits that you can apply for
there are bank loans, there are investors
that you can get into your business.
I'd say that for every scenario
there is a possibility to gain money somewhere.
Quite a number of ways to get to financing.
Maybe it's interesting to have a statement for our entrepreneurs again.
The statement this time is: I recommend looking for funding.
It depends. -Of course, it depends.
Because once you take in financing from somewhere else
there are restrictions and terms to that financing
to finding financing. Do you actually need the funds?
Because raising money for the sake of raising money without a purpose...
You see a lot of entrepreneurs, they got their pitch deck really good
'I raise so much'. But in reality
in my view, the best investor is a paying customer.
That's very true.
Geta, how do you look at this? -I agree with Karim completely.
Most of the times, it's best to have the paying customer.
And then on the other hand, when you have to deal with
like in my case, because we have all the research and development
because we're dealing with electronic textile and things that are like...
A physical product. -Aside from being a physical product
it's also innovation and it's not something that's common and widespread.
You have to fund the innovation in various ways.
You have to figure out how to build it, because it's a long process.
You have to build it, you have to certify it, blah blah blah.
So the good opportunity here
is actually the possibility to fund R&D.
Because there are a bunch of subsidies for that, a bunch of grant opportunities.
There are even loans that
are non-dilutive, so then you can still keep the ownership of your company.
But then again, you can also have access to venture capital
which is a useful tool.
But again, it depends very much on what you're doing.
Because if I remember correctly, you are currently in the process of funding, right?
Yes.
How did you get to the choice of which funding you were going for?
In my case, aside from the fact that we have a lot of R&D in our company
I still have a physical product
that is already there and ready for market release.
Because the innovative versions, well
they are all innovative, but the electronic connected versions
they still have to go through a lot of work.
But we have a product ready for release to market
which means that I can have my company income
and I can have paying clients on top of the R&D part.
So that's a specific of my company
because I have colleagues in the start-up world
who only have the R&D for the first three years
and they can't generate income.
So you really looked for R&D funding in the beginning.
We are looking for R&D funding at this point as well.
But, so... Yeah.
And how did you know how to find this R&D funding?
Did you have a network again? -That was a process. That was a challenge.
To be honest, I had three years that were really, really financially tough.
We had to go through a very tight belt
let's put it this way, period.
The bootstrapping phase. -Oh, yeah.
But then again, it wasn't easy
but on the other hand, I think it's important
not to take on funding before you know where you're going.
Before you can handle it as a company.
We had to explore, so we took our moment there.
That's really good advice. -But then again
we also took that time period to explore the possibilities for funding
because here in the Netherlands, it does give you a lot of opportunities
that are on a spectrum.
You can literally go from subsidies to grants and loans.
So aside from just the money coming in
you have to also take into account: Do you want to keep shares in your company?
Do you want to deal with other people telling you how to run your business?
Do you want to put in an effort and pay out loans?
So you have to have a funding strategy. -Yes.
Not just like: Oh, there's cash, let's go for it.
I can imagine that this strategy, had to be written up in a written plan
for when you were looking for this funding.
You have to put things on paper
because when you go to any funding organisation
they will not give you the money just for the pretty eyes.
That's very true. -You have to turn it into a document.
But before you put it on paper, you have to know what you're putting on paper
and then you have to do the research before that. So it's a backtracking thing.
Karim, do you recognise this situation?
Do you have entrepreneurs in your network that are looking for funding like this?
Sure, we see it all the time. And what's actually interesting in the Netherlands
there's actually advisers that can go and help you raise money.
Of course they take a... It's for a price, of course.
But that's a profession that's readily available to help people raise money.
So we're quite lucky setting up businesses in the Netherlands, actually.
Would you advise entrepreneurs to also look at one of these coaches?
Yeah, absolutely. A hundred per cent. -Definitely.
Johan, can you also relate to the answers Geta and Karim just gave?
I was wondering, did any of you contact me?
Because we as an organisation as well can help in the early process
of getting possibilities out
and maybe even refer you in a certain direction.
But, yeah, I totally agree with what was just told.
And again, keep an eye out for what it is that you need.
I think that's a very valuable point.
It's not just about raising as much capital as you want and can
but there's a need and that needs to be clear.
Once you know that, you can decide which way you're going to go.
That makes it a lot easier to write down all the necessary paperwork.
So I totally agree. -That's good to hear.
Then the advice can be followed.
We've been looking at taxes for entrepreneurs
and what changes when you become a BV.
And we looked at the forms of employment in the Netherlands
and the things that you should take into account when you start hiring staff.
If you want to know more about financing your business
we recommend you watch our webinar on this specific topic.
There, you learn all about the Dutch financial climate
and preparing to apply for Dutch funding
and more about the financing options in the Netherlands we discussed briefly today.
You can find this at our website business.gov.nl.
In the last part of this webinar, we take a closer look
at some important business processes
such as digitisation and cybersecurity.
And how do you prepare if you want to expand your Dutch business internationally?
We will conclude with the advice that our guests have
for you as an entrepreneur with a growing business.
Johan, we've talked about taxes, about staff and financing.
What are the really important processes
that you should look at as an entrepreneur for growing your business?
I'd say that it's actually the two things that you just mentioned.
The world becomes more and more digital these days.
There's a new privacy law in place with a lot of requirements that you need to meet:
the AVG in Dutch, GDPR in English.
That's really something that has been here
for the last few months, the last year.
So that's really something to take into consideration.
There's cybercrime these days that becomes more and more...
That's more here than it was a few years ago.
So be careful with what you do digitally
to avoid those scenarios.
I think that's an important thing.
And also, once you start growing international, I think that's
a huge topic to talk about.
Yes, I can imagine. Especially the part that digitisation...
Your work has changed a bit in the last few years.
So maybe ask the entrepreneurs. These aspects that Johan just mentioned
do you pay attention to those as well? -Yeah, absolutely.
Absolutely, yeah.
In terms of cybersecurity, it's something that you have to invest in and be careful.
I mean, we can't see it when there's attacks and stuff on our website.
Additionally, in terms of digitisation
the Covid pandemic has forced us to do only webinars now.
So unfortunately we're not doing in-person events for a while.
And the data privacy, yes, you have to respect all the rules
tell people what you're doing with their data and get their consent.
All these aspects are very real in today's world.
Yes, and they're becoming more real by the day.
Yes, especially the digitisation, just because of the situation.
And Geta, especially because you use electronics in your product
I can imagine that it's also... -First of all, you can't avoid...
You can't pretend that these regulations don't exist and not take them into account.
But yeah, definitely a lot of...
A lot of the parts of the business are going online and you have to go digital
in many aspects, even if you have a physical product.
Because there is the communication and the interaction with your client
and that's one of the main stakeholders anyway when you're doing business.
But then when we're talking electronics
I do have to deal with sensors.
Of course, it's still in development.
Of course, it has to go through certification processes.
But in our design process, we keep that in mind
so it's getting secured by design
in terms of how we're developing the software.
It's very sensitive information, because we're looking at the health
of infants, so
it can't get any more intimate than that.
So you don't only have to look at digitisation for your company
but also for the product. So you have it both ways.
Good luck with trying to figure that out, then.
Well, we're taking our time. -Good. Smart plan.
Because other than just digitisation
Johan, what other advice would you give entrepreneurs
who are thinking of taking their Dutch business abroad?
Look at the potential market where you're planning on going.
Look at: Is there a need for the product that you're providing?
Do you have the necessary market knowledge
of that specific country or will you be needing local people
to help you to get it up and running?
I think those elements are very important.
And I guess that in your case
actually coming from another country, that's helpful.
You'll probably have your network, people who can help you
gain access to the foreign market.
So use that, use your network.
And if you don't have one yourself, there's all kinds of international networks
that you can hook up with.
The Enterprise Europe Network, for one, is one that can actually help you
launch a product in a different country.
Yes, a really important one. Good that you mentioned it, Johan.
This webinar is too short for all the information.
But on business.gov.nl, you'll find all the information you need
along with specific tips for finding customers and business partners.
For example, the Netherlands Enterprise Agency
offers the business partner scan
to quickly provide you with an overview of potential business partners
in your chosen country.
Geta, which other markets, apart from the Netherlands, are you looking at?
Actually, we're looking at Scandinavia for a bunch of reasons
and we have connected with a distribution company there
for the consumer market.
But then for the health part of the business
we are looking right now... Because we are tackling infant mortality
so we looked at a region that has that specific problem
and that's why we are going to Tanzania
and we are launching there.
That's amazing to be launching. -We're launching our initial study
in a hospital there, because we're making a tool for
preventing neonatal mortality.
But also on top of that
because of the nature of the work that we're doing
I had actually really good support from the Dutch government
in connecting the business to the United Nations programmes.
And that was super valuable. I can't state the value of that.
Wow. So what does that bring you then?
Literally... When was it? Last year.
I had the connection with the RVO officer
who is in charge of connecting Dutch companies
to the UN programmes.
And then I became part of this procurement seminar with the United Nations.
I joined the Dutch delegation to Copenhagen.
Wow, that's quite amazing. -So then we got to register
as a supplier for the United Nations
which is a really high-value opportunity for a company like mine.
That's good to know, that these types of connections can come from that.
So, Karim, looking three years into the future
what will your goals be? And maybe in connection with, of course
the government that can take you there?
Honestly, we're looking to just continue to grow
and, of course, grow to other countries as well.
The whole system in the Netherlands is very supportive for entrepreneurship.
From just having access to capital, having access to labour force
having access to information
and everything readily available in English as well.
It's just the whole business mindset, I think
in this whole infrastructure that we call the Netherlands
that is super helpful.
So that was actually one of the easiest aspects
because it's so set up in the Netherlands. -It's just super easy.
It's really incredible. -Well, that's good to hear, of course.
In retrospect, if that was one of the easiest and best parts
what was one of the biggest challenges you had to overcome?
In all honesty, when I started doing this
I just did it out of love and out of kindness to help people
but that doesn't pay the bills.
So actually, just to know that I had a business
and what to do to make it the successful business than it is today
that was really the challenge, finding what I need to do.
And that's the thing. Knowledge and knowing what you need to do
is probably, in my opinion, the most valuable thing.
It's more valuable than money. It's more valuable than a lot of things.
And I think it's also good for entrepreneurs at home to hear
that you don't have to start off with huge capital
but first off with a passion and that's your driving force.
Because, Geta, in retrospect for you as well
what was your biggest challenge in starting Babymoon?
My biggest challenge was
well, it wasn't a challenge. It was just a process that took a lot of time and effort.
It was figuring out the landscape.
Because I did come to the Netherlands and I was on the programme.
The programme was done with
and then it took a while to set up a network here specifically.
And because I'm pretty niche
it took a while before I found the right people.
Is it something that you would have done differently, if you're looking back at it?
I don't think so.
In finding the right people, that you say: If I would have known this, then...
For example, it's just...
This is not something to put blame on, but
I have a pretty good knowledge of the international landscape
of the baby carrier world.
And I am fluent in Romanian, English and Russian
but I didn't know Dutch.
So it was...
But this is a market-specific situation.
I came here
and I was looking for baby carriers in the Netherlands and I found nothing.
And then I would ask people in the programme
but they were business-related people, so they had no network to that.
So it took me actually over a year, because I didn't know the language
and I didn't have the local network connections.
But in the end, I have done that. Maybe it would have been nice
if I did that faster, but that's that. That's how things are.
So many processes take time.
It's also good to know... -It turned out that the specific language
in the niche that I'm working in, is very different in Dutch.
But this is a case-specific situation.
So, Karim, did you also have a language barrier problem?
I speak Dutch. -Oh, that's true. So you didn't have it.
But actually, because I'm kind of catering to an international audience
and my clients are catering to that same audience
all their communication is done in English.
So it's actually really authentic when I'm just speaking in my native tongue.
I mean, I can read it. Basic Dutch is helpful
but it's not mandatory to have a successful business in the Netherlands.
I can name you tons of expats that I know that have crazy successful businesses
and their Dutch is niet zo best.
That's good to hear, especially because
we're also talking about expanding our business internationally.
The language barrier, of course, in some specific cases could be a thing.
But usually, I mean, English is quite world-wide spoken.
So how do you think, Karim, first off
you will be able to manage your international growth in the upcoming years?
With calm and serenity, meditation and breathing.
It's all about having good people around you. It really is that.
I cannot stress the fact. Have the people you click with, people you can trust
people you can rely on and, you know, you give the trust
and you just do your best and focus on your clients and the people you work with.
Would you agree with that, Geta? -Yeah, definitely.
Is there also maybe a difference when you're growing
and broadening your view internationally when looking for funding?
Well, you always have to work with the people you click with.
Wherever you go, because otherwise it's just
eating you up. You can't.
That's very true and good to mention. -If you want to
achieve your goal, you can't afford putting yourself under stress.
You don't throw yourself under the bus.
You have to manage the business
but you also have to manage your own state
and your own sanity and health so that you can be in a good shape
for the time when you achieve that goal you're working towards.
So it's important. -The people around you are most important.
Who you're working with, but also your funding partners.
That we should really keep in mind.
So Karim, we've heard you talking, of course, about your Expat Republic.
The walking network, where you were able to connect people and move on.
But I was really interested: How did you find people that help you?
Actually the same way. Via via, through people that I know
or through our own network.
So literally, when I need help with something, I ask my community.
So Expat Republic. -Yeah. So that already is so wide
that I can get a lot of reach and get the help that I need.
It's all about being transparent, saying: Hey, I need this help.
And you know, you put out positivity into the world, it comes back to you.
It really is that simple.
Would that also be your advice for all the entrepreneurs watching at home right now?
Yes, definitely. Try and connect with as many people as you can.
Go to networking events, join different expat Facebook groups
join Dutch groups, you know, the local community.
Get involved, get to know people, ask around.
There is a culture in the Netherlands, a very entrepreneurial culture
about helping one another and that's very deeply rooted in the culture.
So it was quite easy for me to get a lot of help.
It's just that business trading mindset is so omnipresent. So we're very lucky.
And I can imagine that's different in other countries.
So would that advice be different if you look outside of the Netherlands?
I think on a general level, there's a lot of commonality around the world.
People are generally good people and want to help.
I just find that the whole business and trade
is so ingrained in the Dutch culture, also historically.
So I think just the ease of doing these things
and it's also very efficient and everything is very well structured.
So it's not so much like... The structure here is really good
when you compare it to other countries. That's really the main thing.
Well, that's good to hear. Glad we are here.
Geta, do you have a last bit of advice for the entrepreneurs
in how to take that next step?
That next step. Well, just keep going.
Find your goal and then work towards it.
And then if it's too much, ask for help.
And again, you have to keep in mind
the business is not necessarily forever.
So if it doesn't work, do not hesitate to stop
do not hesitate to restart, do not hesitate to restructure
because that's how entrepreneurship works.
And always, if I understand you correctly
remember what your passion is and keep going for that.
Thank you so much. Thank you all for your contributions to this webinar today.
So we can conclude that when your business is up and running and even growing
it becomes important to look at issues such as data protection.
We get to deal with the general data protection regulation
the GDPR, or in Dutch: the AVG.
And when you're looking to expand your business across the borders
you should do research on the best markets for your products or services.
Last but not least, we've seen the importance of a good network
and the challenges of keeping your eyes on the future.
We hope you all manage to stay focused.
We've come to the end of this webinar.
We hope this has been an inspiration for you as an entrepreneur
running your business in the Netherlands.
For more information, please visit our website business.gov.nl.
Thank you for watching. Good luck with your business
and we hope to welcome you at our next webinar.