0001 00:00:09:06 00:00:11:21

If you're a foreign entrepreneur

in the Netherlands



0002 00:00:11:24 00:00:14:12

you can benefit from 

a variety of financing options



0003 00:00:14:15 00:00:18:02

on offer from the Dutch government

banks and private agencies.



0004 00:00:18:05 00:00:19:16

In this webinar



0005 00:00:19:19 00:00:23:16

representatives of several organisations

will tell you about these options.



0006 00:00:23:19 00:00:27:02

And experienced entrepreneurs

will share their experiences.



0007 00:00:27:05 00:00:31:09

Before we start our conversation,

I'd like to point out to our viewers



0008 00:00:31:12 00:00:34:18

that a team of specialists

is available to answer your questions.



0009 00:00:34:21 00:00:39:03

So, do you have a question, then use the

live chat option underneath the video screen



0010 00:00:39:06 00:00:42:03

and one of our specialists

will get in touch with you.



0011 00:00:42:06 00:00:46:14

This webinar tells you all there is to know

about the Dutch financing landscape.



0012 00:00:46:17 00:00:48:22

How do you prepare yourself to get funding?



0013 00:00:49:00 00:00:53:17

Which forms of funding can you find, and

how do you sell your plan to your funders?



0014 00:00:53:20 00:00:57:10

These are the topics 

we'll be discussing in the next 60 minutes



0015 00:00:57:13 00:01:00:08

but first, let's take a look at this video.



0016 00:01:00:11 00:01:04:09

The royal kingdom of the Netherlands

is strategically located



0017 00:01:04:12 00:01:09:19

at the North Sea coast between the United 

Kingdom and the vast mainland of Europe.



0018 00:01:09:22 00:01:12:19

The country offers you

a friendly investment climate



0019 00:01:12:22 00:01:14:19

a highly developed infrastructure



0020 00:01:14:22 00:01:20:10

and a population with an average spending

income of over 30,000 euros a year.



0021 00:01:20:13 00:01:23:07

Every year, more businesses

from all over the world



0022 00:01:23:10 00:01:28:10

start their business in the Netherlands.

You are certainly not the only one.



0023 00:01:28:13 00:01:30:12

The Dutch government

welcomes this development.



0024 00:01:30:15 00:01:35:00

However, preparation is the key to success.



0025 00:01:35:03 00:01:39:10

We'll start this webinar with an introduction

of the Dutch financing landscape.



0026 00:01:39:13 00:01:43:04

I'm joined by René Kamphuis

from the Netherlands Enterprise Agency.



0027 00:01:43:07 00:01:46:07

Geert Gladdines

from the Dutch Banking Association



0028 00:01:46:10 00:01:49:02

and Gerhard Nagel,

co-owner Ter Marsch & Co.



0029 00:01:49:05 00:01:51:07

Good to have you

all here in the studio.



0030 00:01:52:10 00:01:55:01

Well, to start off with you René



0031 00:01:55:04 00:02:00:12

you're the coordinator for small and medium 

enterprises at the Netherlands Enterprise Agency.



0032 00:02:00:15 00:02:05:23

Could you say that entrepreneurs from other

countries are welcome here in the Netherlands?



0033 00:02:06:01 00:02:10:16

They're very welcome in the Netherlands.

To give an example



0034 00:02:10:19 00:02:17:17

we provide services

to 350 foreign companies a year.



0035 00:02:17:20 00:02:25:03

That brings forth

10,000 extra jobs in the Netherlands.



0036 00:02:25:06 00:02:29:20

And also,

those companies invest for a total



0037 00:02:29:23 00:02:36:06

of around 2.5 billion euros extra

upon the Dutch economy.



0038 00:02:36:09 00:02:40:04

So they're very welcome.

-So I can hear, yes.



0039 00:02:40:07 00:02:43:04

Which steps does an entrepreneur

have to take



0040 00:02:43:07 00:02:47:00

when he wants to apply

for finance in the Netherlands?



0041 00:02:47:03 00:02:51:17

First of all, you must have a visa

and a residence permit.



0042 00:02:51:20 00:02:55:22

And later on in the process,

you have to register your company



0043 00:02:56:00 00:03:01:06

at the Netherlands Chamber of Commerce

and you have to finance your business.



0044 00:03:01:09 00:03:03:04

That is, of course, very important.



0045 00:03:03:07 00:03:09:11

So that's mostly the time, the first step

you take to get your finance in order.



0046 00:03:09:14 00:03:11:24

Later on, at the Chamber of Commerce



0047 00:03:12:02 00:03:14:16

you can register

your company in a few weeks.



0048 00:03:16:14 00:03:19:12

So, if you're not

from a European economic area



0049 00:03:19:15 00:03:23:02

and need advice and information

about a visa or residence permit



0050 00:03:23:05 00:03:27:00

please watch the on-demand webinar

Starting a Business in the Netherlands



0051 00:03:27:03 00:03:30:17

on Business.gov.nl/webinars.



0052 00:03:32:07 00:03:37:07

So, René, what does an entrepreneur have 

to know when he wants to apply for funding?



0053 00:03:37:10 00:03:41:05

First of all, they have to

prepare themselves very good.



0054 00:03:41:08 00:03:46:07

The financing is never on your blue eyes



0055 00:03:46:10 00:03:51:02

or just a talk with an employee

at a financial institute.



0056 00:03:51:05 00:03:56:05

You have to really prepare yourself

and come up with good plans



0057 00:03:56:08 00:04:03:13

good figures and well, you have to

really have your details in place.



0058 00:04:03:16 00:04:06:16

We'll talk a bit more about that later.



0059 00:04:06:19 00:04:09:19

First, I'd like to welcome

Geert Gladdines



0060 00:04:09:22 00:04:13:02

who is a policy advisor

with the Dutch Banking Association.



0061 00:04:13:05 00:04:14:23

Welcome, Geert.

-Thank you.



0062 00:04:15:01 00:04:18:22

Can you give our viewers us a short 

description of the Dutch financing landscape?



0063 00:04:19:00 00:04:24:15

Yes well, the vast majority of businesses will

start their orientation process with the bank.



0064 00:04:24:18 00:04:29:00

So that's the most straightforward,

regular type of financing



0065 00:04:29:03 00:04:34:03

and they'll either go for a normal loan

or an overdraft facility.



0066 00:04:34:06 00:04:38:12

But the options are widening.

So business can use leasing, for instance



0067 00:04:38:15 00:04:41:08

where they use a machine or vehicle



0068 00:04:41:11 00:04:46:02

that stays in ownership

of the leasing party.



0069 00:04:46:05 00:04:52:13

But also factoring where you can sell your 

invoice in order to free up working capital.



0070 00:04:52:16 00:04:58:23

Or for instance, Qredits which provides

microfinance with a form of coaching as well.



0071 00:04:59:01 00:05:02:21

For the more risk type oriented

forms of capital



0072 00:05:02:24 00:05:06:18

you can go to business angels,

private equity, venture capital



0073 00:05:06:21 00:05:09:15

which is also available in the Netherlands.



0074 00:05:09:18 00:05:12:01

So, lots of options.

-Yes, for sure.



0075 00:05:12:04 00:05:15:16

It involves lots of paperwork, I presume.

-Always.



0076 00:05:15:19 00:05:20:14

But it's in the benefit of the investor,

the bank and the entrepreneur as well.



0077 00:05:20:17 00:05:26:06

If you provide a good plan upfront, you will

make sure you have the right type of financing



0078 00:05:26:09 00:05:31:04

for the kind of business that you're running,

which is the most important.



0079 00:05:31:07 00:05:34:09

Well, I'd also like to welcome Gerhard Nagel.



0080 00:05:34:12 00:05:38:10

You started a burger bar

in Rotterdam in 2013.



0081 00:05:38:13 00:05:42:09

And now you run four of them.

So, I'd like to start at the beginning.



0082 00:05:42:12 00:05:47:16

How did you end up here in the Netherlands?

-I was contacted by my Dutch friend.



0083 00:05:47:19 00:05:54:22

In 2013, he had met a young, high-potential

with an idea to start up a restaurant.



0084 00:05:55:00 00:06:01:04

And the team needed some funding,

the team needed financial knowhow.



0085 00:06:01:07 00:06:03:07

And so I came onboard.



0086 00:06:03:10 00:06:07:13

And what was your idea of the Dutch financing

landscape before you came here?



0087 00:06:07:16 00:06:09:21

I didn't really know about it.



0088 00:06:09:24 00:06:15:18

But banks, financing institutions are pretty

much the same everywhere around the world.



0089 00:06:15:21 00:06:20:13

Is it really exactly the same in,

for instance, your home country Austria?



0090 00:06:20:16 00:06:23:08

Principally yes, it's all about risk.



0091 00:06:23:11 00:06:27:05

No financing institution, no bank

wants to lose their money.



0092 00:06:27:08 00:06:31:08

So they'll go through

a diligent process with you



0093 00:06:31:11 00:06:35:06

to make sure they understand

the business plan and they find it viable.



0094 00:06:35:09 00:06:38:08

What's the difference with Austria?



0095 00:06:38:11 00:06:42:22

The ease of starting up

a business in the Netherlands



0096 00:06:43:00 00:06:49:03

is probably better and faster

than in many other countries.



0097 00:06:50:13 00:06:52:19

That's good,

a good reason to be here.



0098 00:06:52:22 00:06:57:03

That’s a very good reason to be here.

-You started with three Dutch partners.



0099 00:06:57:06 00:07:01:07

Did that help to get funding?

-I think it helps.



0100 00:07:01:10 00:07:05:18

We talked about it before: What

would it be like for Austrians applying?



0101 00:07:05:21 00:07:12:15

We'd run a higher risk of failing

with four people not knowing the country.



0102 00:07:12:18 00:07:17:09

You need local knowhow in running

a restaurant, you need to know the market.



0103 00:07:17:12 00:07:20:09

It's good to speak the language.

-Yes.



0104 00:07:20:12 00:07:24:11

And did you apply while you were in

the Netherlands or were you abroad?



0105 00:07:24:14 00:07:26:12

I was at the time still abroad.



0106 00:07:26:15 00:07:30:24

It was just a business idea

at the inception phase.



0107 00:07:31:02 00:07:36:07

I was working with our commercial

partner on writing a business plan



0108 00:07:36:10 00:07:40:22

to ask funds from a local bank.



0109 00:07:41:00 00:07:46:01

René, do you have to be present

in the Netherlands to apply for funding?



0110 00:07:46:04 00:07:49:01

Or is it possible

to apply online, for example?



0111 00:07:49:04 00:07:55:02

Yes, at the government instruments

you can apply online.



0112 00:07:55:05 00:07:58:24

Most of the instruments

are applied online.



0113 00:07:59:02 00:08:02:05

So you don't have to be

in the Netherlands before you apply.



0114 00:08:02:08 00:08:07:11

But later on

in the phase of your application



0115 00:08:07:14 00:08:14:00

you'll have to talk to someone

in life being there.



0116 00:08:14:03 00:08:17:21

So you have to be in the Netherlands

to finish your application.



0117 00:08:17:24 00:08:20:06

They want to meet you face-to-face.

-Yes.



0118 00:08:20:09 00:08:25:21

Does this apply to all types of financing?

-Yes. Actually, it does.



0119 00:08:25:24 00:08:32:19

There isn't an instrument of financial

support that you can apply online



0120 00:08:32:22 00:08:38:24

and not seeing anybody and start

your business. That's not possible.



0121 00:08:39:02 00:08:41:23

It's still personal.

-Yes, it's personal.



0122 00:08:42:01 00:08:48:02

Geert, the economy is doing well, but

financing is still a bit of an issue.



0123 00:08:48:05 00:08:51:09

What's important for Dutch banks?



0124 00:08:51:12 00:08:57:10

In the credit application process and the

risk analysis the bank is going to make



0125 00:08:57:13 00:09:01:01

they'll look at whether an entrepreneur

will make money.



0126 00:09:01:04 00:09:05:23

If you make money, you can pay back

your loan and interest payments.



0127 00:09:06:01 00:09:11:16

And it's very important for the bank

to make sure that you have cashflow



0128 00:09:11:19 00:09:15:14

and also that you're able to absorb losses.



0129 00:09:15:17 00:09:20:18

So you bring in your own equity, your own

capital and that you can provide guarantees.



0130 00:09:20:21 00:09:23:21

If, in the end,

something wouldn't work out



0131 00:09:23:24 00:09:28:04

that you will be able to pay back

the bank with collateral.



0132 00:09:28:07 00:09:31:13

And Gerhard, you also

invested in yourself, didn't you?



0133 00:09:31:16 00:09:35:23

I can absolutely confirm what Geert is

saying. The bank is managing risk.



0134 00:09:36:01 00:09:39:16

So they want to see you

bring on some own equity



0135 00:09:39:19 00:09:43:12

because if you don't believe

in your own plan, why would they?



0136 00:09:45:06 00:09:49:20

It's very important

to work on your business plan



0137 00:09:49:23 00:09:53:04

not only on the numbers,

but on the supporting story.



0138 00:09:53:07 00:09:54:23

The numbers and the story.



0139 00:09:55:01 00:09:58:18

They have to build a unity

and support each other.



0140 00:09:58:21 00:10:04:13

But was it, well, did the bank

actually ask you to invest yourself?



0141 00:10:04:16 00:10:08:07

Or was it your own idea?

-It's a prerequisite.



0142 00:10:08:10 00:10:16:02

The bank is demanding 20 to 30% of equity

otherwise they wouldn't fund you.



0143 00:10:16:05 00:10:20:12

Okay, and how much did you invest?



0144 00:10:20:15 00:10:27:09

For our first, small Ter Marsch burger bar

we needed 200,000 euro



0145 00:10:27:12 00:10:33:15

and we put our own equity in

which was nearly 80,000 at the time.



0146 00:10:35:09 00:10:38:11

What are the other demands

of the banks?



0147 00:10:39:11 00:10:46:13

They want to see some

private, personal guarantees.



0148 00:10:46:16 00:10:53:03

So, you also have to sign

with your private will on to that loan.



0149 00:10:53:24 00:10:56:07

Are you responsible as a private person?



0150 00:10:56:10 00:10:59:17

Yes.

-So, it's a little bit of a risk.



0151 00:10:59:20 00:11:04:19

It's definitely a risk and that's why

it's so important to do the homework



0152 00:11:04:22 00:11:08:07

when you prepare the business plan.

It's not an exercise for the bank.



0153 00:11:08:10 00:11:13:14

It's an exercise to check

if it's possible to make a profit.



0154 00:11:13:17 00:11:17:16

Are cashflows coming out

from the business proposal?



0155 00:11:17:19 00:11:21:18

And Geert,

are there types of businesses



0156 00:11:21:21 00:11:24:22

that are more likely

to get funding than others?



0157 00:11:25:00 00:11:27:11

And well,

maybe even the other way round.



0158 00:11:27:14 00:11:31:20

Are there types of businesses that are

less likely to succeed in getting money?



0159 00:11:31:23 00:11:34:01

As a general rule, no.



0160 00:11:34:04 00:11:38:10

Any business that comes to the bank

will get the same treatment, like:



0161 00:11:38:13 00:11:40:21

Will you be able to pay back the loan?



0162 00:11:40:24 00:11:43:02

But there are types of...



0163 00:11:43:05 00:11:47:13

It depends also on competition,

on which kind of market are you in.



0164 00:11:47:16 00:11:50:04

Is it business to consumer or B2B?



0165 00:11:50:07 00:11:54:20

And there types of business, for instance,

like clothing, construction



0166 00:11:54:23 00:11:59:06

and retail,

tailored directly also to consumers



0167 00:11:59:09 00:12:04:21

that might be more susceptible to

economic downturns making it more risky.



0168 00:12:04:24 00:12:10:07

So that are examples where the bank will

have different questions about guarantees



0169 00:12:10:10 00:12:15:23

then, for instance, machinery construction

or production companies.



0170 00:12:16:01 00:12:18:22

It's safe to conclude

that the higher the risk



0171 00:12:19:00 00:12:21:09

the more of your own money

you have to invest.



0172 00:12:21:12 00:12:23:12

Usually yes.

-Okay.



0173 00:12:23:15 00:12:25:04

René, you've already told us



0174 00:12:25:07 00:12:28:15

that international entrepreneurs

are more than welcome here.



0175 00:12:28:18 00:12:33:02

Is there a way that the Dutch

government actually contributes



0176 00:12:33:05 00:12:37:10

to encourage the Dutch financing landscape?

-Yes, certainly.



0177 00:12:37:13 00:12:41:09

For instance,

we have SME guarantee schemes.



0178 00:12:41:12 00:12:48:07

We have all kinds of subsidies,

we've risk capital available for start-ups.



0179 00:12:48:10 00:12:51:17

We also do a lot of advisory work.



0180 00:12:51:20 00:12:57:06

I advise about 3,000 companies a year

with my unit.



0181 00:12:57:09 00:13:01:00

We work together a lot

with the Chamber of Commerce



0182 00:13:01:03 00:13:07:10

and we do a lot of activities together

to reach out to the start-ups.



0183 00:13:07:13 00:13:11:16

And the new companies in the Netherlands

so we do a lot together.



0184 00:13:11:19 00:13:15:02

It seems so. And do entrepreneurs

actually make use of this?



0185 00:13:15:05 00:13:20:03

Yes, they do and we try to

reach out ourselves as well.



0186 00:13:20:06 00:13:23:04

We are visible on our website



0187 00:13:23:07 00:13:27:01

but we also work together 

with the Chamber of Commerce



0188 00:13:27:04 00:13:29:17

with business.gov.nl



0189 00:13:30:18 00:13:35:16

and we try to attend

to as much as events as possible.



0190 00:13:35:19 00:13:42:10

We're also available on a lot of places

where entrepreneurs come together



0191 00:13:42:13 00:13:47:03

like Incubators or special buildings

for starting companies.



0192 00:13:47:06 00:13:51:21

So, we have a lot of interaction

and that's basically our main job.



0193 00:13:51:24 00:13:57:02

Good, well, to recap: entrepreneurs are

more than welcome in the Netherlands.



0194 00:13:57:05 00:13:59:13

There is a wide variety

of funding available



0195 00:13:59:16 00:14:03:05

if you come very well-prepared.

A simple handshake won't do.



0196 00:14:03:08 00:14:07:17

Before you apply for funding make sure you 

have a valid residence and working permit.



0197 00:14:07:20 00:14:12:00

I see we have a viewer's question

and it's for you Gerhard.



0198 00:14:12:03 00:14:15:04

Is it necessary to know people

in the Netherlands



0199 00:14:15:07 00:14:18:06

when you want to apply for a loan?

-Yes.



0200 00:14:18:09 00:14:21:21

I think it's good, it's helpful.



0201 00:14:21:24 00:14:27:00

If you have local people who know

the language, who know the ways



0202 00:14:27:03 00:14:30:23

it's absolutely supportive in your plans.

-Good to know.



0203 00:14:31:01 00:14:35:24

Well, I'd like to thank all three of you:

René, Gerhard, Geert



0204 00:14:36:02 00:14:39:22

for all your experience and expertise,

thank you for sharing.



0205 00:14:40:00 00:14:44:17

If you want more information,

please take a look on business.gov.nl



0206 00:14:44:20 00:14:47:04

or ask your question to our chat team.



0207 00:14:50:23 00:14:55:12

The most important condition for getting

funding for your business is preparation.



0208 00:14:55:15 00:14:59:11

An essential part in this

is writing a professional business plan.



0209 00:14:59:14 00:15:03:14

This plan has to meet requirements.

I'll talk about these requirements



0210 00:15:03:17 00:15:07:13

with Angèle Margré, business advisor

at Netherlands Chamber of Commerce.



0211 00:15:07:16 00:15:10:10

Geert Gladdines,

policy advisor corporate service



0212 00:15:10:13 00:15:12:07

at the Dutch Banking Association.



0213 00:15:12:10 00:15:15:02

And Gerhard Nagel,

co-owner Ter Marsch & Co.



0214 00:15:15:05 00:15:16:19

Welcome, good that you're here.



0215 00:15:17:20 00:15:22:07

Angèle, you've seen a lot

of business plans in your career.



0216 00:15:22:10 00:15:26:00

Can you tell us which components

should be in a business plan?



0217 00:15:26:03 00:15:29:20

It's a bit of a triangle.

You start with your personal belongings



0218 00:15:29:23 00:15:33:04

and your personal skills

being an entrepreneur.



0219 00:15:33:07 00:15:37:08

Who are you as an entrepreneur? What

are your skills, education and experience?



0220 00:15:37:11 00:15:41:07

And why do you want to start a business.

The second chapter is marketing.



0221 00:15:41:10 00:15:45:03

The marketing strategy. Why do you

want to start this kind of business?



0222 00:15:45:06 00:15:49:05

With these activities.

Who are your clients?



0223 00:15:49:08 00:15:53:17

What are their needs?



0224 00:15:53:20 00:15:57:14

And why are you starting this

marketing strategy and your purpose?



0225 00:15:57:17 00:16:01:17

And the third part, it's the most

difficult part, is the financial plan.



0226 00:16:01:20 00:16:06:06

And that required your revenues, 

your investments, your financial plan



0227 00:16:06:09 00:16:10:04

your loans and your return on investments.



0228 00:16:10:07 00:16:14:19

In order to improve your understanding

of the importance of a business plan



0229 00:16:14:22 00:16:16:17

please watch the following video.



0230 00:16:19:04 00:16:23:17

You have a brilliant idea, a gap

in the market, an amazing product.



0231 00:16:23:20 00:16:27:20

An indispensable app.

You're enthusiastic about this.



0232 00:16:27:23 00:16:31:10

You see opportunities,

but can you get it done?



0233 00:16:31:13 00:16:34:24

You are motivated

and just want to go, go, go.



0234 00:16:35:02 00:16:39:23

Stop, that's not smart.

Your idea deserves better.



0235 00:16:40:01 00:16:43:04

Would you just start pouring concrete

if you want to build a house?



0236 00:16:43:07 00:16:47:03

Of course not.

You're the architect of your own success.



0237 00:16:47:06 00:16:53:02

And just like an architect, you build 

better, easier and faster with a blueprint.



0238 00:16:53:05 00:16:56:10

And do you know how

you can be successful in business?



0239 00:16:56:13 00:16:59:03

By having a business plan

as your blueprint.



0240 00:16:59:06 00:17:02:06

It provides insight

in the feasibility of your idea.



0241 00:17:02:09 00:17:05:05

And at the same time,

it's a step-by-step plan.



0242 00:17:05:08 00:17:07:17

It gives you control during hard times.



0243 00:17:07:20 00:17:11:13

It's an exploration of the future

during the building process.



0244 00:17:11:16 00:17:14:05

It forces you to describe the foundation



0245 00:17:14:08 00:17:17:05

and which walls

are going to support the success.



0246 00:17:17:08 00:17:21:06

It teaches you what is necessary

to shape your visionary idea.



0247 00:17:21:09 00:17:24:04

In your business plan,

you'll list your own plans.



0248 00:17:24:07 00:17:27:16

You'll answer questions like:

What do I want to do exactly?



0249 00:17:27:19 00:17:32:03

Where am I going to establish myself?

Which legal form am I going to choose?



0250 00:17:32:06 00:17:35:17

Is there a market for my product?

How do I find customers?



0251 00:17:35:20 00:17:39:04

How much money do I need

to get my plans off the ground?



0252 00:17:39:07 00:17:42:06

Often the design will change a bit

during this process.



0253 00:17:42:09 00:17:45:01

You discover what is and isn't possible.



0254 00:17:45:04 00:17:48:03

By asking feedback

from friends, family and experts



0255 00:17:48:06 00:17:51:24

you'll discover construction faults

and how to prevent them.



0256 00:17:54:01 00:17:57:01

In the end, you know

how beautiful your success can be



0257 00:17:57:04 00:18:00:19

and how you can achieve that

with as much purpose as passion.



0258 00:18:00:22 00:18:03:12

And as much motivation as inspiration.



0259 00:18:03:15 00:18:08:23

The business plan, the foundations of

business success and financing your ideas.



0260 00:18:09:08 00:18:12:11

Angèle,

how do I fill out the financial part



0261 00:18:12:14 00:18:17:09

knowing that entrepreneurs find this the

most difficult part of a business plan?



0262 00:18:17:12 00:18:19:24

Most entrepreneurs

find it the most difficult part.



0263 00:18:20:02 00:18:23:14

I think it's the most boring part

for the financial plan.



0264 00:18:23:17 00:18:28:11

At first, you make four budgets.

The first one is the investment budget.



0265 00:18:28:14 00:18:32:15

And that's all the stuff and articles

you need to start up your company.



0266 00:18:32:18 00:18:35:12

Put it on the left side of your sheet,

it'll be your dream.



0267 00:18:35:15 00:18:38:23

So, it's going to be the inventory,

the machinery, the transport.



0268 00:18:39:01 00:18:41:11

All the stuff you need to start your company.



0269 00:18:41:14 00:18:43:24

On the right side

is going to be your worst nightmare.



0270 00:18:44:02 00:18:47:06

So, you ask yourself:

Where do I get the money from?



0271 00:18:47:09 00:18:51:24

There are several possibilities.

First is bringing in your own money.



0272 00:18:52:02 00:18:58:00

Like your own savings or subordinated loan

from family or friends.



0273 00:18:58:03 00:19:02:11

And the other possibility to get a loan

or credit from outside capital



0274 00:19:02:14 00:19:07:14

like a bank or crowdfunding,

but also an informal investor.



0275 00:19:07:17 00:19:12:18

So those two financial budgets

are your opening sheet



0276 00:19:12:21 00:19:15:08

your opening balance

so they must be equal.



0277 00:19:15:11 00:19:20:04

The third one is the budget

most entrepreneurs forget to make



0278 00:19:20:07 00:19:23:18

because it's your private budget.

-You have to put that in too?



0279 00:19:23:21 00:19:27:09

Yes, because how much money

do you need to earn for your own living?



0280 00:19:27:12 00:19:29:24

For your own fixed costs or expenses, yes?



0281 00:19:30:02 00:19:33:20

So that's a difficult one.

The fourth one is the operating budget.



0282 00:19:33:23 00:19:38:04

That's the most budget the banks like



0283 00:19:38:07 00:19:44:03

because that's the budget how you,

for instance, determine your hourly rate



0284 00:19:44:06 00:19:47:23

your purchase

and that's also your revenues.



0285 00:19:48:01 00:19:51:15

So the bank will know

how much will you earn



0286 00:19:51:18 00:19:55:06

to pay us back

and to get your return on investment.



0287 00:19:55:09 00:19:59:14

So, and you make three.

For the one, is the realistic one.



0288 00:19:59:17 00:20:03:24

The second one of for the future and

the third one is to grow with your company.



0289 00:20:04:02 00:20:06:19

Okay. Gerhard,

when you started your business



0290 00:20:06:22 00:20:08:16

did you know

how to make a business plan?



0291 00:20:08:19 00:20:13:14

I did and I like Angèle saying

the number part is the most boring part.



0292 00:20:13:17 00:20:18:05

I'm a finance professional,

I like the numbers part.



0293 00:20:18:08 00:20:21:22

But that's why I wrote my business

plan with my commercial partner.



0294 00:20:22:00 00:20:24:05

He also finds it more boring.



0295 00:20:24:08 00:20:28:17

So it's very important

that the commercial story is in line



0296 00:20:28:20 00:20:32:06

tangoes with the numbers.

It should be one story.



0297 00:20:32:09 00:20:36:19

So, don't write it on your own.

Team up.



0298 00:20:36:22 00:20:40:14

And make it perfect towards the bank.

-I like that, a tango.



0299 00:20:40:17 00:20:43:17

It makes it less boring, at least, yes.



0300 00:20:43:20 00:20:46:21

So, what are the most components

of a business plan?



0301 00:20:46:24 00:20:48:22

The most important components.



0302 00:20:50:13 00:20:53:08

Well, if I might start?

-Yes.



0303 00:20:53:11 00:20:58:00

It starts with the idea,

with a passionate idea.



0304 00:20:58:03 00:21:01:14

You translate it into the first numbers.



0305 00:21:01:17 00:21:04:06

In our case,

in the Ter Marsch burger restaurant:



0306 00:21:04:09 00:21:08:13

How many burgers are we going to sell

on a Monday, Tuesday, a Saturday?



0307 00:21:08:16 00:21:12:09

You have a profit & loss account.

You put a balance sheet.



0308 00:21:12:12 00:21:16:21

You make a capex, a capital

expenditure list, of what you need.



0309 00:21:16:24 00:21:21:10

The kitchen, the tables.

How much money are you going to create?



0310 00:21:21:13 00:21:25:14

Will you be able to pay back

the financing agencies, the banks?



0311 00:21:25:17 00:21:28:07

As you said.

-Yes.



0312 00:21:28:10 00:21:31:22

But the most important chapter

of the business plan



0313 00:21:32:00 00:21:33:17

is the entrepreneur itself.



0314 00:21:33:20 00:21:37:11

Because the entrepreneur

is someone with the motivation



0315 00:21:37:14 00:21:41:12

with the passion to start a company. We

say: You can make or break the company.



0316 00:21:41:15 00:21:46:15

So when there is confidence without

the outside capital from the bank



0317 00:21:46:18 00:21:51:13

or an informal investor 

the owner, the entrepreneur



0318 00:21:51:16 00:21:55:22

is the only one 

who makes it grow and sustainable.



0319 00:21:56:00 00:21:59:16

I confirm that. When we went to the bank,

they didn't jump on the numbers.



0320 00:21:59:19 00:22:02:14

They didn't jump on the stories.

They said: Who are you?



0321 00:22:02:17 00:22:06:04

How do you get on with each other?

How do you complement each other?



0322 00:22:06:07 00:22:11:06

Will you still be friends in five years' time?

What a risk if it breaks up.



0323 00:22:11:09 00:22:15:21

Realistic question, yes.

That's good to know as well.



0324 00:22:15:24 00:22:18:12

Banks want guarantees.



0325 00:22:18:15 00:22:24:02

How can you show that you are 

a safe bet in the business plan?



0326 00:22:24:05 00:22:26:11

To have a good idea.



0327 00:22:26:14 00:22:29:22

To know what kind of niche

you want to act in.



0328 00:22:30:00 00:22:35:20

Because almost all branches

are really done here in Holland.



0329 00:22:35:23 00:22:38:08

So you must find something unique



0330 00:22:38:11 00:22:42:06

to cooperate or to work in.



0331 00:22:43:15 00:22:46:17

And you almost bring your own capital



0332 00:22:46:20 00:22:50:17

and that must be 

your own bank account or savings



0333 00:22:50:20 00:22:54:09

but also you must look

if there is a possibility



0334 00:22:54:12 00:22:56:23

to do the bootstrapping

of your own company.



0335 00:22:57:01 00:23:00:15

Today: I'm also in risk,

not only the outside capital.



0336 00:23:00:18 00:23:03:02

But I want to invest

also for my own company



0337 00:23:03:05 00:23:06:12

and I'll take some risk

to invest in the company.



0338 00:23:06:15 00:23:08:16

Do you agree with this Geert?



0339 00:23:08:19 00:23:12:06

Yes, I think entrepreneurs

like naturally they are optimistic.



0340 00:23:12:09 00:23:15:23

And banks are naturally looking

at the risk side of the business.



0341 00:23:16:01 00:23:17:22

And I think you should

meet each other in the middle.



0342 00:23:18:00 00:23:22:06

Because there is the financial plan

that is also helping the entrepreneur



0343 00:23:22:09 00:23:25:22

structure the business in the way

the business is going to run.



0344 00:23:26:00 00:23:29:19

The bank really wants to know:

you want this amount of money



0345 00:23:29:22 00:23:32:13

as a loan from me.

How are you going to use it?



0346 00:23:32:16 00:23:36:12

Are you going to use it for building, are you

going to use it for a car, for an oven?



0347 00:23:36:15 00:23:39:08

Are you going to use it

for the salary payments of your employees?



0348 00:23:39:11 00:23:43:24

And the more you can provide insights on how

exactly are you going to spend the money



0349 00:23:44:02 00:23:47:21

also the better overview you'll have

as an entrepreneur yourself



0350 00:23:47:24 00:23:50:16

on the way your business will run.



0351 00:23:50:19 00:23:55:02

And maybe to add on

the risk side of the business



0352 00:23:55:05 00:23:57:18

the bank will ask for guarantees

on the loan.



0353 00:23:57:21 00:24:01:24

So they want collateral,

that can be a house that you



0354 00:24:02:02 00:24:06:16

or a house you have yourself or the

building that you bought as a business.



0355 00:24:06:19 00:24:11:16

And if, what nobody hopes, of course,

but it happens, the company goes bankrupt



0356 00:24:11:19 00:24:16:13

you can put that house or building

up as collateral for the loan



0357 00:24:16:16 00:24:19:20

that you initially got from the bank.



0358 00:24:19:23 00:24:22:18

Geert mentioned something very important.

He said:



0359 00:24:22:21 00:24:26:20

the entrepreneur is very optimistic,

the bank is more pessimistic.



0360 00:24:26:23 00:24:30:24

When I go to the bank,

I have both scenarios with me.



0361 00:24:31:02 00:24:35:24

I have a realistic positive scenario:

what could possibly go wrong?



0362 00:24:36:02 00:24:40:21

I also have a very down to earth scenario:

how much buffer is there?



0363 00:24:40:24 00:24:45:09

That's the worst nightmare you mentioned?

-Yes, and when we see



0364 00:24:45:12 00:24:48:23

the business plan

with the financial plan



0365 00:24:49:01 00:24:51:24

we usually kept the cost

and the expenses the same



0366 00:24:52:02 00:24:55:13

but decrease the turnover

about for 50 per cent.



0367 00:24:55:16 00:24:58:04

And then we look,

is it useful to start a company



0368 00:24:58:07 00:25:00:16

and how was your return on investment?

Do you get the revenues



0369 00:25:00:19 00:25:04:15

and will you be able to pay the bank

back from the loan you rented?



0370 00:25:04:18 00:25:08:19

I much agree. Like the fixed costs

that you have, they remain the same.



0371 00:25:08:22 00:25:12:16

It's always the same amount that you

spend on your building, on your staff



0372 00:25:12:19 00:25:15:11

on your income

and the interest to the bank.



0373 00:25:15:14 00:25:20:06

The turnover you're making, that's

where you actually make the profits.



0374 00:25:20:09 00:25:23:06

And usually when you sell some services



0375 00:25:23:09 00:25:27:09

your hourly rate will be

about 100 euros



0376 00:25:27:12 00:25:32:10

but you only work the half of the hours

you can work every year.



0377 00:25:32:13 00:25:37:20

So the rate must be very high

and must be really calculated



0378 00:25:37:23 00:25:40:01

to earn the money, yes, yes.



0379 00:25:40:04 00:25:43:03

To cover all the costs,

all those and insurances.



0380 00:25:43:06 00:25:45:14

Gerhard,

what was the most difficult part?



0381 00:25:46:08 00:25:50:11

Well, I hear that the numbers

are the most difficult part for people.



0382 00:25:50:14 00:25:53:18

As a finance guy, the numbers

are not the most difficult part for me.



0383 00:25:53:21 00:25:58:15

Easy for you?

-The most difficult part is:



0384 00:25:58:18 00:26:04:02

don't underestimate the paperwork.

It is a lot of paperwork.



0385 00:26:04:05 00:26:07:05

It starts with the story

with the compassionate story



0386 00:26:07:08 00:26:11:20

commercial story, market research and

the numbers have to complement it.



0387 00:26:11:23 00:26:15:16

And be prepared

or get someone into the team



0388 00:26:15:19 00:26:18:11

to follow up on the paperwork



0389 00:26:18:14 00:26:22:18

on setting up, establishing your company,

the paperwork for the banks.



0390 00:26:22:21 00:26:27:24

And many other things before, in our case,

before we sell the first hamburger.



0391 00:26:28:02 00:26:31:03

There is a lot of red tape involved,

of course.



0392 00:26:31:06 00:26:35:06

Red tape? Can you explain that?

-Red tape, a lot of paperwork.



0393 00:26:35:09 00:26:39:22

Can you explain certain rules maybe

you had to think of with that paperwork?



0394 00:26:40:00 00:26:42:23

The business plan itself,

we talked about it



0395 00:26:43:01 00:26:46:14

I think has a very, nearly rigid structure



0396 00:26:46:17 00:26:49:23

and a minimum set of requirements

for the bank



0397 00:26:50:01 00:26:54:16

or anyone else who reads business plans

would look for.



0398 00:26:54:19 00:26:59:07

And the rest

is very specific to the business.



0399 00:26:59:10 00:27:02:15

In our case, setting up a restaurant

you've got permits.



0400 00:27:02:18 00:27:05:01

You've got to get a liquor license.

-Yes.



0401 00:27:05:04 00:27:08:01

You've got very clear rules

if you have a terrace.



0402 00:27:08:04 00:27:13:04

Where to put the chairs and what is

the space to be able to walk through?



0403 00:27:13:07 00:27:18:23

And that's all got to go

in the request for that permit.



0404 00:27:19:01 00:27:22:12

And there is many more things to consider.

-Yes, lots of work.



0405 00:27:22:15 00:27:27:04

You applied for a banking loan. Did you

consider any other type of financing?



0406 00:27:27:07 00:27:30:17

Yes, we did.

As we discussed before



0407 00:27:30:20 00:27:36:11

the bank financing is the cheapest form.



0408 00:27:36:14 00:27:40:09

If you manage to convince the bank

you have a viable business plan



0409 00:27:40:12 00:27:43:21

it's the best way in terms of cost.



0410 00:27:43:24 00:27:47:04

If you go to crowdfunding

or any of the other mentioned ones



0411 00:27:47:07 00:27:53:20

your cost will increase.

So I think the bank is your first stop



0412 00:27:53:23 00:27:56:15

for possible financing of your business.



0413 00:27:56:18 00:28:00:21

I just heard that there is another

viewer's question. It's for you, Gerhard.



0414 00:28:00:24 00:28:04:09

What should everybody know

when applying for finance?



0415 00:28:04:12 00:28:07:18

What should everybody know?



0416 00:28:07:21 00:28:13:16

That, well, it's a rigid process



0417 00:28:13:19 00:28:19:19

that you have to follow. It's a process

where you can get support



0418 00:28:19:22 00:28:24:02

online, as we've heard,

from many institutions.



0419 00:28:24:05 00:28:29:15

And it's a story you have to develop



0420 00:28:29:18 00:28:32:13

together with your

commercial business partner.



0421 00:28:32:16 00:28:35:23

It's a kind of you dance a tango.



0422 00:28:36:01 00:28:40:13

It's a commercial number-tango,

they both have to support each other.



0423 00:28:40:16 00:28:44:14

One is not enough without the other.

-What's your view on this, Geert?



0424 00:28:44:17 00:28:49:09

I mean, for me it's do your homework.

So make sure you have the right plan.



0425 00:28:49:12 00:28:51:17

Another tip I'd like

to give to entrepreneurs



0426 00:28:51:20 00:28:53:15

is take the outside perspective.



0427 00:28:53:18 00:28:57:04

Would I invest in this business

if it was not my own business?



0428 00:28:57:07 00:29:01:18

And because as an entrepreneur, you are

in love with the company you're founding



0429 00:29:01:21 00:29:05:24

or that you started and you're growing,

but make sure that...



0430 00:29:06:02 00:29:09:21

Think like a bank or as an outside investor

and would you still put in your money



0431 00:29:09:24 00:29:13:17

that you're asking somebody else?

-Put in your own money.



0432 00:29:13:20 00:29:17:04

As well. 

-Angèle, what I'd like to know:



0433 00:29:17:07 00:29:18:23

Is a business plan obligatory?



0434 00:29:19:01 00:29:21:07

No, you're not obliged

to make a business plan.



0435 00:29:21:10 00:29:26:02

But when you're searching for a loan then

you're obliged to make a business plan



0436 00:29:26:05 00:29:30:22

because the bank looks for all 

the chapters within the company.



0437 00:29:31:00 00:29:35:06

So, yes, then it's obliged, but it's easy

to make a business plan for yourself.



0438 00:29:35:09 00:29:40:15

It'll give you, you can look to

the purpose you make, the focus



0439 00:29:40:18 00:29:43:23

and it makes transparency for the company.



0440 00:29:44:01 00:29:48:16

And when it's out of your mind

and it's on paper it give you also



0441 00:29:48:19 00:29:52:03

a relax to start up the company.

-Yes, I can imagine that.



0442 00:29:52:06 00:29:54:24

It's not static, it moves on with you.



0443 00:29:55:02 00:29:58:13

It's a good process to go through,

writing your business plan.



0444 00:29:58:16 00:30:01:23

It makes you focus on all these aspects



0445 00:30:02:01 00:30:06:07

and you'll probably find out things

that you would have forgotten maybe



0446 00:30:06:10 00:30:08:17

if you wouldn't have gone

through this process.



0447 00:30:08:20 00:30:11:04

It gives you some structure as well.

-Exactly.



0448 00:30:11:07 00:30:14:16

Where can people find information

on writing their business plan?



0449 00:30:14:19 00:30:18:02

You can write on a beermat,

that's also possible.



0450 00:30:18:05 00:30:19:23

It's a bit small.



0451 00:30:20:01 00:30:23:04

But when it's a very good idea

like a burger



0452 00:30:23:07 00:30:26:12

it combines with the beermat.



0453 00:30:26:15 00:30:28:17

There are also some templates.



0454 00:30:28:20 00:30:33:14

I think every Dutch bank has a template

for making a business plan.



0455 00:30:33:17 00:30:38:06

But there are also other organisations

like Qredits for microfinancing.



0456 00:30:38:09 00:30:42:09

They have also a template

to make a business plan.



0457 00:30:43:10 00:30:45:01

Do you have any tips?



0458 00:30:47:01 00:30:50:12

In this sense, like what I said:

Make sure you do your homework.



0459 00:30:50:15 00:30:53:02

Seek advice.



0460 00:30:53:05 00:30:56:18

So, if you're insecure about

parts of your business plan



0461 00:30:56:21 00:31:00:22

if you're not the best at marketing

or not the best at the financial plan



0462 00:31:01:00 00:31:05:19

make sure that you ask your bookkeeper

or an external financial planner, advisor



0463 00:31:05:22 00:31:09:00

to help you with it. Still make sure

that you understand it yourself



0464 00:31:09:03 00:31:11:12

because you're the entrepreneur.

You have to run the business.



0465 00:31:11:15 00:31:16:04

So you have to understand your finances

and seek help from other entrepreneurs.



0466 00:31:16:07 00:31:20:10

Go to people in the same business

or a totally different business



0467 00:31:20:13 00:31:23:10

who basically went through

what you're going through.



0468 00:31:23:13 00:31:27:08

And make sure

that you keep their advice in mind.



0469 00:31:27:11 00:31:31:22

Anything to add to that, Gerhard?

-Just before you go pitch it to the bank



0470 00:31:32:00 00:31:36:20

indeed, pitch it to other people.

You get feedback



0471 00:31:36:23 00:31:43:05

and you'll be much more secure and

good in presenting to the bank then.



0472 00:31:43:08 00:31:46:22

It's also possible to pitch at the Chamber 

of Commerce. We don't lend money



0473 00:31:47:00 00:31:50:12

but we want to help you 

to go further with your company.



0474 00:31:50:15 00:31:56:18

Okay. For more information please have 

a look on the website business.gov.nl.



0475 00:31:56:21 00:32:00:24

I'd like to thank all of you,

Angèle, Gerhard and Geert.



0476 00:32:01:02 00:32:03:22

Thank you for sharing

your expertise and experiences.



0477 00:32:04:00 00:32:05:03

You're welcome.



0478 00:32:08:15 00:32:10:20

An essential part of your business plan



0479 00:32:10:23 00:32:13:22

is choosing a type of financing

suitable for your business.



0480 00:32:14:00 00:32:18:16

In the Netherlands there are many types of

financing, but which one do you choose?



0481 00:32:18:19 00:32:22:19

I'll talk about this with René Kamphuis

from the Netherlands Enterprise Agency.



0482 00:32:22:22 00:32:28:02

Gertjan Tienkamp, account manager at the

crowdfunding platform Geldvoorelkaar.



0483 00:32:28:05 00:32:30:10

Roy Spit, director of Qredits



0484 00:32:30:13 00:32:33:05

and Claudio Gerardi, owner of Fietseria.



0485 00:32:33:08 00:32:37:10

Before we start our conversation,

let's take a look at an overview first.



0486 00:32:37:13 00:32:40:06

Are you looking for ways

to finance your business?



0487 00:32:40:09 00:32:43:18

Consider the different possibilities

and combinations.



0488 00:32:43:21 00:32:47:12

If you only approach 

one financing institution e.g. a bank



0489 00:32:47:15 00:32:51:05

then this party

is unlikely to lend you the entire amount.



0490 00:32:52:05 00:32:55:23

The bank namely wants you

to invest part of your own capital.



0491 00:32:56:01 00:33:01:14

Or find other investors e.g. family,

friends, an informal investor.



0492 00:33:01:17 00:33:07:12

An investment fund or crowdfunding.

By investing capital yourself



0493 00:33:07:15 00:33:10:13

you can convince the bank

to give you an additional loan.



0494 00:33:10:16 00:33:14:24

The government can also contribute

e.g. by guaranteeing financing



0495 00:33:15:02 00:33:19:05

or by bringing you into contact

with suitable financing parties.



0496 00:33:19:08 00:33:23:10

Combining multiple ways of financing

is called a financing mix.



0497 00:33:23:13 00:33:26:23

A financing mix will ensure

that you find the most suitable investor



0498 00:33:27:01 00:33:28:24

for different parts of the total investment.



0499 00:33:32:00 00:33:36:16

With the financing mix you can get

the capital needed to execute your plans.



0500 00:33:39:10 00:33:41:22

Welcome Claudio Gerardi.

-Hello.



0501 00:33:42:00 00:33:46:00

How did you find out

about the different types of financing?



0502 00:33:46:03 00:33:51:10

At the begin, I start to do some research

on the web.



0503 00:33:51:13 00:33:58:19

Then I ask some friends and other people

who are already running a business.



0504 00:33:58:22 00:34:04:02

And also I receive some info

from the Chamber of Commerce



0505 00:34:04:05 00:34:08:13

when I start up, when I register myself

in their company.



0506 00:34:08:16 00:34:12:02

Very good. And you've started

your own business, Fietseria.



0507 00:34:12:05 00:34:13:23

Here in the Netherlands. Why here?



0508 00:34:14:01 00:34:17:23

So, I work in the horeca field

since ten years



0509 00:34:18:01 00:34:23:23

and I discover different places in Italy

and in Europe, as well.



0510 00:34:24:01 00:34:27:08

I went in London

before to be in the Netherlands



0511 00:34:27:11 00:34:32:20

but I didn't like the English lifestyle.



0512 00:34:32:23 00:34:38:05

On a suggestion of a friend,

I chose to come in Amsterdam.



0513 00:34:38:08 00:34:42:22

In 2015, and for me it was



0514 00:34:44:07 00:34:50:06

a nice surprise

to see that in the Netherlands



0515 00:34:50:09 00:34:55:07

the lifestyle is way better.

-Oh, yes?



0516 00:34:55:10 00:34:58:14

Than other countries that I already tried.



0517 00:34:58:17 00:35:02:24

So, for me was kind of also first love

if we can say like that.



0518 00:35:03:02 00:35:07:01

Let's take a look at your company,

Fietseria, and the way you financed it.



0519 00:35:07:04 00:35:08:19

We have a video to take a look at.



0520 00:35:08:22 00:35:10:08

Nice.

-Nice, I'm curious.



0521 00:35:10:11 00:35:13:10

Fietseria is a new mobile catering concept



0522 00:35:13:13 00:35:17:05

and it works

for private catering and events.



0523 00:35:17:08 00:35:21:17

This new concept brings pizza

everywhere and for everybody.



0524 00:35:21:20 00:35:26:11

I'm Italian, I'm a pizza lover

and I know how real food taste like.



0525 00:35:28:12 00:35:32:06

I start in 2017 this new concept.



0526 00:35:32:09 00:35:35:18

I was looking to build up

an ecologic food truck.



0527 00:35:35:21 00:35:41:02

To build up a new catering service

and build up the Fietseria.



0528 00:35:41:05 00:35:45:10

When I start the project,

this special bike was still a prototype.



0529 00:35:45:13 00:35:52:00

So, was not on the market.

Luckily, I find it one day on the street



0530 00:35:52:03 00:35:54:07

and then I find the name of the company.



0531 00:35:54:10 00:36:01:17

The first steps was to calculate the cost

for the entire project.



0532 00:36:01:20 00:36:06:24

And with some money saved on my own

I start to buy some machinery.



0533 00:36:07:02 00:36:12:12

I calculate that I need an extra budget

for end up the structure.



0534 00:36:12:15 00:36:18:19

I wrote a business plan. I download

credit form of the business plan.



0535 00:36:18:22 00:36:25:02

And when I did the log-in, Qredits

gives to me all the necessary tools



0536 00:36:25:05 00:36:28:21

to build up a stable business plan,

to do a right research.



0537 00:36:28:24 00:36:34:14

After some researches, I figured out

that there were different ways



0538 00:36:34:17 00:36:38:10

on how to get my money.

One was the bank way.



0539 00:36:38:13 00:36:44:07

The other one was the crowdfunding

and then the micro-financial.



0540 00:36:44:10 00:36:48:03

The first step was to ask around



0541 00:36:48:06 00:36:52:20

to people who were already

running business, some tips.



0542 00:36:52:23 00:36:56:15

Due to the fact

that my budget was not that tight



0543 00:36:56:18 00:36:59:11

I choose for the micro-financial.



0544 00:36:59:14 00:37:02:22

Because was the easiest

and the fastest way to offer me money.



0545 00:37:03:00 00:37:05:21

I'm working as a freelance pizzaiolo



0546 00:37:05:24 00:37:10:04

and I'm developing catering service

and festivals.



0547 00:37:10:07 00:37:13:16

Moreover, I'm working to build up

a new structure for the Fietseria



0548 00:37:13:19 00:37:16:19

and try to make it a franchising.



0549 00:37:23:18 00:37:28:23

Roy Spit, your company Qredits

believed in the idea of Claudio. Why?



0550 00:37:29:01 00:37:33:03

Claudio really prepared himself.

He went to the Chamber of Commerce.



0551 00:37:33:06 00:37:38:02

He had a viable business plan,

he sent in the right documents.



0552 00:37:38:05 00:37:42:19

So, he had a location scan

of the Chamber of Commerce made.



0553 00:37:42:22 00:37:46:17

So, that was for us

the first main step to meet him.



0554 00:37:46:20 00:37:51:07

With all the documents, our loan advisor

made an appointment with Claudio.



0555 00:37:51:10 00:37:54:01

Then we thought:

this is the man who is baking pizzas.



0556 00:37:54:04 00:37:57:02

We saw it in the film

so no doubt about that.



0557 00:37:57:05 00:38:01:04

Claudio, are you already

making a living with the Fietseria?



0558 00:38:01:07 00:38:06:10

No, because Fietseria

is still an ongoing prototype.



0559 00:38:06:13 00:38:11:05

We're on the last phases of the project

so in the meantime



0560 00:38:11:08 00:38:16:15

I'm working as a freelance pizzaiolo.

I'm doing some consultancy.



0561 00:38:16:18 00:38:19:01

What's a pizzaiolo? It's very Italian.



0562 00:38:19:04 00:38:22:15

Yes, pizzaiolo,

in Dutch you can say pizzabakker.



0563 00:38:22:18 00:38:28:04

So you're doing this job together with

the pizzaiolo and the Fietseria together?



0564 00:38:28:07 00:38:32:20

Yes, let's say that Fietseria

is a project to follow.



0565 00:38:32:23 00:38:38:18

And I'm almost done to put the structure

and product on the market.



0566 00:38:38:21 00:38:41:12

Ready for other people.



0567 00:38:41:15 00:38:47:02

But in the meantime, yes,

I'm working as a pizzaiolo.



0568 00:38:47:05 00:38:49:00

Very good.

-Like what I said.



0569 00:38:49:03 00:38:52:10

And I'm doing 

some consultancy on the side.



0570 00:38:52:13 00:38:58:08

And when I get the opportunity to do

some catering or events, I'm also in.



0571 00:38:58:11 00:39:00:15

Thank you so much.

Roy, I was wondering.



0572 00:39:00:18 00:39:05:21

Your company is specialized in 

microfinance. What is microfinance?



0573 00:39:05:24 00:39:10:07

Well, microfinance actually is the...

We started in 2009.



0574 00:39:10:10 00:39:14:02

As a microfinance company

and that means we are a foundation.



0575 00:39:14:05 00:39:19:16

As a foundation we help entrepreneurs,

starting and existing entrepreneurs



0576 00:39:19:19 00:39:22:15

with loans up to 250,000 euros.



0577 00:39:22:18 00:39:26:15

But microfinance is not only about loans,

it's also about mentoring



0578 00:39:26:18 00:39:29:04

supplying the right tools.

For example, Claudio



0579 00:39:29:07 00:39:33:17

who used our template to write 

a business plan, our e-Learnings.



0580 00:39:33:20 00:39:39:06

So microfinance is more than just a loan.

It's all about mentoring, tools and credit.



0581 00:39:39:09 00:39:43:22

Okay, and what's the main difference

between Qredits and a bank?



0582 00:39:44:00 00:39:47:21

The main difference

is that we are a foundation



0583 00:39:47:24 00:39:52:11

and for the banks who have shareholders

and we talk a lot about shareholders value



0584 00:39:52:14 00:39:57:12

but shareholders are important for a bank

so profit is very important for a bank.



0585 00:39:57:15 00:40:02:00

That makes it very hard for a bank

to make these small loans profitable.



0586 00:40:02:03 00:40:06:03

And for us, as a foundation,

that's not our main target.



0587 00:40:06:06 00:40:11:08

Our main target is to help the entrepreneurs

and to be sustainable.



0588 00:40:11:11 00:40:15:10

I think that's the main difference.

-Okay, and Claudio



0589 00:40:15:13 00:40:17:14

you chose microfinancing.



0590 00:40:17:17 00:40:22:13

Why did you think

this was the best way for you?



0591 00:40:22:16 00:40:28:01

I was looking

to get a small amount of money.



0592 00:40:28:04 00:40:31:19

Also take a look

into the crowdfunding process.



0593 00:40:31:22 00:40:38:08

But I thought that for a crowdfunding

process you need a bigger plan.



0594 00:40:38:11 00:40:44:03

And also the time for a crowdfunded

process is way longer



0595 00:40:44:06 00:40:49:19

than what a microfinancing process can be.



0596 00:40:49:22 00:40:54:04

So then, yes, I chose for Qredits.



0597 00:40:54:07 00:40:59:09

Because as I told you, it was the easiest

and fastest way for my money.



0598 00:40:59:12 00:41:03:13

You talked about crowdfunding. Gertjan,

you know everything about crowdfunding.



0599 00:41:03:16 00:41:08:01

And is a concept like Claudio's Fietseria

interesting for crowdfunding?



0600 00:41:08:04 00:41:11:10

Yes, it is. We have to make

an appointment after the show.



0601 00:41:11:13 00:41:14:17

Why not?

-But yes, it sure is.



0602 00:41:14:20 00:41:18:11

What are the basics of crowdfunding?

-The basics are that



0603 00:41:18:14 00:41:22:19

you get small amounts of funding

by a large amount of people.



0604 00:41:22:22 00:41:28:04

So, for example, if you need 25,000 euros,

we can get 100 people



0605 00:41:28:07 00:41:32:21

who all do 250 euros

and then you get a large pot of money.



0606 00:41:32:24 00:41:35:01

And we can help entrepreneurs

get that capital.



0607 00:41:35:04 00:41:38:07

For what kind of companies

is crowdfunding an option?



0608 00:41:38:10 00:41:41:09

Well, it's suitable

for all kinds of enterprises



0609 00:41:41:12 00:41:46:09

but the most of the projects we do

for small to medium-sized enterprises.



0610 00:41:46:12 00:41:50:09

It's essential that the entrepreneur

has a good business plan.



0611 00:41:50:12 00:41:54:18

And a decent track record.



0612 00:41:54:21 00:42:00:23

At crowdfunding you have to convince

investors to invest in your proposition.



0613 00:42:01:01 00:42:05:07

So that's a track record

and the business case has to be good.



0614 00:42:05:10 00:42:12:10

A lot of people think that crowdfunding

is just a donation form.



0615 00:42:12:13 00:42:14:09

Or for social projects.

-Is it not?



0616 00:42:14:12 00:42:16:15

It is, but you have multiple options.



0617 00:42:16:18 00:42:23:19

Because like 70 per cent of all

crowdfunding projects are socially-related.



0618 00:42:23:22 00:42:29:10

But 90 per cent of the money invested

in crowdfunding is for enterprises.



0619 00:42:29:13 00:42:34:01

I didn't know that. If you want to know if

crowdfunding is suitable for your company



0620 00:42:34:04 00:42:39:07

you're welcome to take the crowdfunding

scan at business.gov.nl/crowdfunding.



0621 00:42:41:05 00:42:47:13

So, Roy and Gertjan, how do people,

companies reach out to you?



0622 00:42:49:06 00:42:53:08

I think most of the smaller enterprises

just have a look on the internet.



0623 00:42:53:11 00:42:58:14

Like Claudio did. Google is your best

friend when you come to the Netherlands.



0624 00:42:58:17 00:43:03:11

And there you see multiple options,

so I think it's a lot through the internet



0625 00:43:03:14 00:43:07:12

but we see a lot

of professionals helping start-ups



0626 00:43:07:15 00:43:12:22

like accountants, bookkeepers

or other professionals or consultants.



0627 00:43:13:00 00:43:17:10

And they also have a great view

of the alternative finance landscape.



0628 00:43:17:13 00:43:19:06

So, they can also help you



0629 00:43:19:09 00:43:22:23

but for the smaller amounts we see

a lot of people looking on the internet.



0630 00:43:23:01 00:43:26:14

How do you know if an idea is viable?



0631 00:43:26:17 00:43:30:18

That's a good question. We think that we

have to meet Claudio to have a good idea.



0632 00:43:30:21 00:43:36:22

But as I said before, it starts with sending

in a viable business plan or the documents.



0633 00:43:37:00 00:43:41:01

Like Gertjan said: You know, you really

need documents to get an idea



0634 00:43:41:04 00:43:44:19

if it's wise to visit the applicants.



0635 00:43:44:22 00:43:49:19

It starts with sending in and really

think through what you're sending in.



0636 00:43:49:22 00:43:54:15

We see that 40 per cent of all the

applications are without any documents.



0637 00:43:54:18 00:43:58:13

So, then you can be a good entrepreneur,

but it doesn't help you



0638 00:43:58:16 00:44:03:17

to make the first main step and to have

a visit from one of our loan officers.



0639 00:44:03:20 00:44:09:02

Gertjan, crowdfunding as a means

of financing is growing in stature.



0640 00:44:09:05 00:44:12:02

Do you have any idea 

why this is happening?



0641 00:44:12:05 00:44:15:12

The crowdfunding market

really matured over the years.



0642 00:44:15:15 00:44:19:00

When we started with

Geldvoorelkaar in 2011



0643 00:44:19:03 00:44:23:01

it was the first crowdfunding platform

in the Netherlands



0644 00:44:23:04 00:44:27:08

and it was all new for investors

and for entrepreneurs.



0645 00:44:27:11 00:44:30:02

And now it's more known



0646 00:44:30:05 00:44:37:19

and when banks

offer low interest on savings



0647 00:44:37:22 00:44:42:17

investors want to look for other options.

Low accessible, easy accessible options.



0648 00:44:42:20 00:44:47:21

And that's why investors

like to invest in entrepreneurs.



0649 00:44:47:24 00:44:52:19

And for the entrepreneur,

they look for capital.



0650 00:44:52:22 00:44:57:24

And we bring those two together.

-There are different types of crowdfunding.



0651 00:44:58:02 00:45:02:03

Which types are there exactly?

-I'll define four.



0652 00:45:02:06 00:45:06:14

You have the donation-based model,

like I said earlier.



0653 00:45:06:17 00:45:10:05

Then there is no reward

for the investment you do.



0654 00:45:10:08 00:45:14:09

Then you have a reward-based model.



0655 00:45:14:12 00:45:17:07

That's like you get a T-shirt

or a pen or a glass.



0656 00:45:17:10 00:45:22:17

But also like Kickstarter that you get

a product for the investment you make.



0657 00:45:22:20 00:45:28:23

Then there is equity-based. So for your

investment you get a share of the company.



0658 00:45:29:01 00:45:34:07

Or through a convertible loan.

And there is the loan-based model.



0659 00:45:34:10 00:45:36:22

And a loan-based model is, like it says:



0660 00:45:37:00 00:45:40:22

It's a mini loan with which

you help the entrepreneur



0661 00:45:41:00 00:45:44:01

and you get repaid and interest for it.



0662 00:45:44:04 00:45:47:24

Which type is used most often?

-The last one.



0663 00:45:48:02 00:45:54:00

It's really clear and simple. For

the investor, they know they get repaid.



0664 00:45:54:03 00:45:59:00

And they get return on their investment,

like interest.



0665 00:45:59:03 00:46:02:22

And the entrepreneur knows

for the duration of the loan



0666 00:46:03:00 00:46:08:02

I have to pay this amount every month,

on a monthly basis including interest.



0667 00:46:08:05 00:46:13:05

A combination of crowdfunding

and microfinancing is that common?



0668 00:46:13:08 00:46:16:20

It happens.

At the moment, we go live



0669 00:46:16:23 00:46:20:18

with a project

that is started with microfinance



0670 00:46:20:21 00:46:25:09

and it has matured over the years

and now it's scaling up.



0671 00:46:25:12 00:46:29:06

And they come to us

and we do a crowdfunding campaign.



0672 00:46:29:09 00:46:32:11

I see you nodding Roy. Do you agree?

-Yes, it is possible



0673 00:46:32:14 00:46:38:07

but let us not make it too fancy.



0674 00:46:38:10 00:46:43:03

Because there is also

some difficulty in combining



0675 00:46:43:06 00:46:45:13

and that's that we all

want to have some collateral.



0676 00:46:45:16 00:46:49:21

I think it's very hard to combine

the same type of finance



0677 00:46:49:24 00:46:55:00

like crowdfunding, banks and Qredits

up to 250,000 euros.



0678 00:46:55:03 00:46:58:04

The smaller amount is harder

than bigger amounts to combine.



0679 00:46:58:07 00:47:02:22

We see a lot of combinations

with other types of alternatives like



0680 00:47:03:00 00:47:06:07

when you talk about leasing or factoring



0681 00:47:06:10 00:47:09:18

it's easier to combine

different kinds of alternatives



0682 00:47:09:21 00:47:14:01

than the same kind of alternatives

because then it comes to collateral



0683 00:47:14:04 00:47:18:03

and we all want to have some collateral.

-What Roy says is totally true



0684 00:47:18:06 00:47:22:06

about the collateral,

but there are entrepreneurs



0685 00:47:22:09 00:47:26:04

who look for crowdfunding

because there is a second advantage.



0686 00:47:26:07 00:47:28:17

That's the marketing aspect of it.

-Of course.



0687 00:47:28:20 00:47:32:17

Because every investor investing

is a promotor for your company.



0688 00:47:32:20 00:47:35:14

If I invest 1000 dollars in a bakery



0689 00:47:35:17 00:47:39:13

I'll tell all my friends and family

to buy a bread at that place.



0690 00:47:39:16 00:47:42:03

So that's the marketing

and publicity effect



0691 00:47:42:06 00:47:45:01

that a lot of entrepreneurs

like about crowdfunding.



0692 00:47:45:04 00:47:50:17

And it works.

-What kind of loans does Qredits offer?



0693 00:47:50:20 00:47:53:10

Actually, we have three types of loans.

It's quite easy.



0694 00:47:53:13 00:47:56:05

We have micro loans,

it's up to 50,000 euros.



0695 00:47:56:08 00:48:01:05

Then we have SME loans for the medium

enterprises up to 250,000 euros.



0696 00:48:01:08 00:48:05:02

And we have flexible loan. A

flexible loan is more for working capital.



0697 00:48:05:05 00:48:07:20

And it's up to 25,000 euros.



0698 00:48:07:23 00:48:10:14

So these are the three types

of loans we have.



0699 00:48:11:17 00:48:13:21

How does that work exactly?



0700 00:48:13:24 00:48:16:22

To do an application or the type of loan?

-Yes.



0701 00:48:17:00 00:48:24:06

The type. We only have loans that you

repay within between one to ten years.



0702 00:48:24:09 00:48:28:15

We also do mortgages

and these are up to 20 years.



0703 00:48:28:18 00:48:32:21

So, if you want to buy a property

for your business that's also possible.



0704 00:48:32:24 00:48:34:22

Then it's up to 20 years.



0705 00:48:35:00 00:48:38:12

That's also a branch very difficult

for banks at the moment.



0706 00:48:38:15 00:48:40:14

Properties for businesses.



0707 00:48:40:17 00:48:45:12

But most of our loans are about

repayment within four or five years.



0708 00:48:45:15 00:48:49:21

So, that's the typical loan. I don't

know what kind of loan you had?



0709 00:48:49:24 00:48:52:09

I have the microfinancing loan



0710 00:48:52:12 00:48:56:12

and I will pay back the entire amount

in three years.



0711 00:48:56:15 00:48:59:23

Three years?

-Most of the time we have a grace period.



0712 00:49:00:01 00:49:06:04

For start-ups it's better to only pay

interest in the first five or six months.



0713 00:49:06:07 00:49:09:00

So you can build up...

-That's the way I chose.



0714 00:49:09:03 00:49:12:08

Then you can build up your business,

get some cash flow



0715 00:49:12:11 00:49:15:05

and then you can pay it back

in three, four, five years



0716 00:49:15:08 00:49:17:10

but only up to ten years.



0717 00:49:17:13 00:49:21:07

The flexible loan,

then you don't have a repayment.



0718 00:49:21:10 00:49:26:15

So, within 25,000 euros

you can repay and you can withdraw.



0719 00:49:26:18 00:49:30:01

So, it's like, sort of a bank account.

-Exactly.



0720 00:49:30:04 00:49:34:06

Okay. And how do you apply?

Digitally or in person?



0721 00:49:34:09 00:49:36:24

We still get some post



0722 00:49:37:02 00:49:40:17

but 99% of all the applications

come through the internet.



0723 00:49:40:20 00:49:43:10

You get some post, actually?

-Yes, we do.



0724 00:49:43:13 00:49:46:21

Real paper.

-Real paper, yeah exactly.



0725 00:49:46:24 00:49:51:06

But most of them come through the internet.

It's only three-four steps.



0726 00:49:51:09 00:49:53:22

The preparation, if you have the documents



0727 00:49:54:00 00:49:57:16

within five minutes you can do an

application. Also at Geldvoorelkaar.



0728 00:49:57:19 00:50:00:24

If you have the documents

it's not so hard to apply.



0729 00:50:01:02 00:50:04:19

Is it the same for crowdfunding?

-We're an online-based company.



0730 00:50:04:22 00:50:06:23

So, it goes through our website



0731 00:50:07:01 00:50:13:22

but we do discover possibilities by phone,

mail or in person with the entrepreneur.



0732 00:50:14:00 00:50:18:07

Or with an accountant or advisor

like Roy said earlier.



0733 00:50:18:10 00:50:23:00

First you apply online?

-Basically it's online.



0734 00:50:23:03 00:50:26:12

When the financing proposal is ready

we publish it online



0735 00:50:26:15 00:50:28:24

and investors invest online.



0736 00:50:29:02 00:50:31:06

I would like to involve René again.



0737 00:50:31:09 00:50:34:02

Welcome back, René.

-Thank you.



0738 00:50:34:05 00:50:38:22

Can the government offer help?

Maybe, like, subsidize?



0739 00:50:39:00 00:50:40:19

Yes, of course.



0740 00:50:40:22 00:50:47:04

We have a lot of financial instruments

available for entrepreneurs.



0741 00:50:48:13 00:50:55:10

It's not always like crowdfunding

or micro credits alone.



0742 00:50:55:13 00:51:02:03

But we offer a lot of instruments that fill

in the gaps in the financial landscape.



0743 00:51:02:06 00:51:06:19

That's basically also the main goal

of the government.



0744 00:51:06:22 00:51:10:13

We also have a lot of subsidies in place



0745 00:51:10:16 00:51:17:03

to achieve some stimulation

in the economy on certain points.



0746 00:51:17:06 00:51:21:07

Very relevant at the moment

is energy saving



0747 00:51:21:10 00:51:24:11

and new energy projects.



0748 00:51:24:14 00:51:27:11

There are subsidies for these investments.



0749 00:51:27:14 00:51:30:20

What are the conditions

for getting a subsidy?



0750 00:51:30:23 00:51:35:17

They differ a lot,

because subsidies differ also



0751 00:51:35:20 00:51:40:00

in the goals that they have to meet.



0752 00:51:40:03 00:51:45:24

But in general you just

have to fill in forms for a subsidy



0753 00:51:46:02 00:51:49:15

that describes where you are

going to use the money for.



0754 00:51:49:18 00:51:55:16

And what the investment is going to be

where you apply the subsidy for.



0755 00:51:55:19 00:51:59:13

What are the chief misunderstandings

concerning subsidies?



0756 00:51:59:16 00:52:05:24

Well, the biggest mistake that people

have in their heads about subsidies



0757 00:52:06:02 00:52:11:24

is that they think that every financial

instrument of the government is a subsidy.



0758 00:52:12:02 00:52:13:14

It's not?

-No, it's not.



0759 00:52:13:17 00:52:17:00

And it's even less than,

for instance, ten years ago.



0760 00:52:17:03 00:52:20:14

There are less and less

subsidies available.



0761 00:52:20:17 00:52:27:01

Instead, you will find instruments

like loans, like SME guarantees



0762 00:52:27:04 00:52:31:12

where we provide a guarantee

to a bank loan



0763 00:52:31:15 00:52:35:01

where there's not enough

collateral for the bank.



0764 00:52:35:04 00:52:42:14

In that case we can provide the collateral

that the bank needs to provide the loan.



0765 00:52:42:17 00:52:50:11

But we also have equity programs

and proof-of-concept funding.



0766 00:52:50:14 00:52:57:06

We do a lot of different kinds

of instrumental projects.



0767 00:52:57:09 00:53:00:17

I want to get back to Gertjan and Roy.

What are the risks...



0768 00:53:00:20 00:53:04:16

or let me rephrase it,

the pitfalls for entrepreneurs?



0769 00:53:04:19 00:53:10:22

I come back to the subject of transparency.

That's quite important, also in the plan.



0770 00:53:11:00 00:53:15:09

We see a lot of entrepreneurs, most of

them have only a best case scenario.



0771 00:53:15:12 00:53:18:23

That's very good. They're an

entrepreneur and apply for a loan



0772 00:53:19:01 00:53:25:00

because they think: I really have

this plan and it can only succeed.



0773 00:53:25:03 00:53:27:22

But reality is different.

Anything can happen:



0774 00:53:28:00 00:53:31:02

Illness, divorce.



0775 00:53:31:05 00:53:35:11

So, also think about what will happen

in a worst-case scenario.



0776 00:53:35:14 00:53:39:09

When turnover isn't that good,

or whatever, you know.



0777 00:53:39:12 00:53:43:00

Just think about it and write

something about it in your plan.



0778 00:53:43:03 00:53:45:21

Do you have a partner with income?



0779 00:53:45:24 00:53:50:18

All the subjects are important for us

as a finance institute



0780 00:53:50:21 00:53:55:09

to know how your reaction is

when you get in trouble.



0781 00:53:55:12 00:53:59:17

For us that is very important to know

and write it down in your business plans.



0782 00:53:59:20 00:54:05:09

Most applications don't have anything

in their plan about this



0783 00:54:05:12 00:54:07:22

so I would really recommend to do that.



0784 00:54:08:00 00:54:09:17

A good tip.

-Thanks.



0785 00:54:09:20 00:54:14:21

Did you think about the pitfalls

when you started your Fietseria?



0786 00:54:14:24 00:54:18:15

Yes, but luckily



0787 00:54:18:18 00:54:23:15

I have a really nice job. Really.



0788 00:54:23:18 00:54:27:08

Because a job as a pizzaiolo is well-paid.



0789 00:54:27:11 00:54:34:03

So in the case that my supposition

would go on a bad way



0790 00:54:34:06 00:54:39:04

I still got my job,

and I can pay back the loan.



0791 00:54:39:07 00:54:42:06

You discussed this with Qredits as well

when you asked for financing?



0792 00:54:42:09 00:54:45:06

Of course.

-You wrote it in your business plan.



0793 00:54:45:09 00:54:48:17

As well, yeah.

-You talked to the Chamber of Commerce.



0794 00:54:48:20 00:54:52:00

You had a location scan.

You did quite some preparation.



0795 00:54:52:03 00:54:54:19

I have to say that I received a lot of help



0796 00:54:54:22 00:54:58:19

from the phone assistant of Qredits

and the Chamber of Commerce.



0797 00:54:58:22 00:55:03:02

Really, they helped me out a lot

and I just...



0798 00:55:03:05 00:55:05:19

I just had one question



0799 00:55:05:22 00:55:10:22

and they filled my brain with a lot

of information. So, it was really helpful.



0800 00:55:11:00 00:55:13:21

There's a question for you

to fill your brain with.



0801 00:55:14:21 00:55:19:17

What did you underestimate during

the process? It's a viewer's question.



0802 00:55:19:20 00:55:22:14

Yes, what I underestimate.



0803 00:55:22:17 00:55:30:04

I underestimate the fact

that a good plan can save you time.



0804 00:55:30:07 00:55:33:03

And in business time are money.



0805 00:55:33:06 00:55:36:21

So, I developed the project



0806 00:55:38:23 00:55:40:22

together with a job on side.



0807 00:55:41:00 00:55:45:09

So, supposed to be back

and restart again



0808 00:55:45:12 00:55:50:20

I will focus more on the planning

of the whole project.



0809 00:55:50:23 00:55:55:11

Well, we have another question for you

from the viewers.



0810 00:55:55:14 00:56:00:03

If you had to start the financing process

again, what would you do differently?



0811 00:56:01:19 00:56:05:00

First, an important point for me



0812 00:56:05:03 00:56:11:01

is to understand how to split the business

from your private life.



0813 00:56:11:04 00:56:15:18

This, for me,

was a big problem at the end.



0814 00:56:15:21 00:56:22:01

When you start, you...

For me, with anything new, so...



0815 00:56:22:04 00:56:24:19

all my focus was on my project.



0816 00:56:24:22 00:56:27:11

I understand that people

might be annoyed



0817 00:56:27:14 00:56:32:17

that I were talking about

my Fietseria always any time.



0818 00:56:32:20 00:56:36:10

And you can lose some friends.

-Ah, did you?



0819 00:56:36:13 00:56:39:02

Yeah, I did, but...



0820 00:56:39:05 00:56:43:11

It doesn't matter. That means

this friend was not really important.



0821 00:56:43:14 00:56:47:06

Thank you so much, gentlemen,

for sharing your information with us.



0822 00:56:47:09 00:56:49:24

Summing up, there are

many possibilities to get funding



0823 00:56:50:02 00:56:53:21

depending on the kind of business you

have and the amount of money you need.



0824 00:56:53:24 00:56:56:12

You have to be able

to give detailed information



0825 00:56:56:15 00:56:59:24

and be able to pay back.

Thanks again.



0826 00:57:03:14 00:57:07:01

Be to the point, don't arrive late

and look neat.



0827 00:57:07:04 00:57:09:20

These are some elements

of the perfect pitch.



0828 00:57:09:23 00:57:13:06

I'll talk about how you can

present yourself to an investor



0829 00:57:13:09 00:57:17:14

with Gertjan Tienkamp of the

crowdfunding platform Geldvoorelkaar



0830 00:57:17:17 00:57:22:15

Roy Spit, director of Qredits and

Claudio Gerardi, owner of Fietseria.



0831 00:57:22:18 00:57:24:01

Claudio.

-Hi, hello.



0832 00:57:24:04 00:57:29:08

Hello. How did your presentation go?

Did it go well?



0833 00:57:29:11 00:57:34:16

For me, it was easy to get a line to follow.



0834 00:57:34:19 00:57:39:11

So: where do I have to put this,

I have to find the right info.



0835 00:57:39:14 00:57:42:21

And how did it go?

Where you relaxed or stressed?



0836 00:57:42:24 00:57:47:05

No, I was a bit stressed, but...



0837 00:57:47:08 00:57:53:15

At the end I was sure that the idea

got good walue, value, sorry.



0838 00:57:53:18 00:57:59:14

Okay, so that relaxed you a little bit?

-Yes, that was my calm point.



0839 00:57:59:17 00:58:02:02

How did you prepare exactly?



0840 00:58:02:05 00:58:08:12

I wrote down a business plan,

which was not big. Just three pages.



0841 00:58:08:15 00:58:13:21

I put in the business plan some numbers

about provision.



0842 00:58:14:23 00:58:18:24

I also included some picture of the bike

because at the time people



0843 00:58:19:02 00:58:24:14

couldn't imagine how pizza bike look like.



0844 00:58:24:17 00:58:29:07

Then, also I added

something about my private life



0845 00:58:29:10 00:58:35:24

which was my income at the moment,

which job I was doing on the time.



0846 00:58:37:10 00:58:39:22

So that was very complete.



0847 00:58:40:00 00:58:44:16

What important tips did you receive from

the Chamber of Commerce and Qredits?



0848 00:58:44:19 00:58:50:20

I received a lot of important tips

from these two entities.



0849 00:58:50:23 00:58:56:20

The first one, and the most important,

was a right form of business plan.



0850 00:58:59:01 00:59:03:05

From the Chamber of Commerce

I received marketing research



0851 00:59:03:08 00:59:06:21

which was specific for my field.



0852 00:59:08:02 00:59:14:15

Moreover, I received tips on

how to deposit my trademark



0853 00:59:14:18 00:59:20:04

because that was my biggest problem:



0854 00:59:20:07 00:59:23:15

How to protect my idea,

as such a new idea.



0855 00:59:25:03 00:59:26:12

They helps me a lot.



0856 00:59:26:15 00:59:33:06

So, they direct me to another association,

which is the BOIP.



0857 00:59:34:10 00:59:43:06

They help me also on how to

edit the trademark deposit.



0858 00:59:43:09 00:59:48:22

Okay, and did you also get tips like,

did you have to be a BV or not?



0859 00:59:49:00 00:59:53:00

Yes, this was another important question

on the time.



0860 00:59:53:03 00:59:56:10

Because I was working as a ZZP'er.



0861 00:59:56:13 01:00:00:22

And I asked if for the Fietseria

I should make a BV.



0862 01:00:01:00 01:00:06:17

But, luckily, they suggested me

to continue on that way.



0863 01:00:06:20 01:00:12:13

Then if the Fietseria would get value



0864 01:00:12:16 01:00:14:20

then you can transform it in a BV.



0865 01:00:14:23 01:00:16:07

Yeah.



0866 01:00:16:10 01:00:19:20

And Roy, what does

a good presentation consist of?



0867 01:00:19:23 01:00:23:16

Well, let's say we visit all our...



0868 01:00:23:19 01:00:25:19

Or most of our applicants.



0869 01:00:25:22 01:00:29:22

When it's an existing business,

we visit them at their business.



0870 01:00:30:00 01:00:32:24

When they're a start-up

we visit them at their home.



0871 01:00:33:02 01:00:39:01

So, it's very important for us to visit

the applicant in their own environment.



0872 01:00:39:04 01:00:43:24

What we see, I wouldn't recommend to

open the door in your sleeping outfit...



0873 01:00:44:02 01:00:47:08

Do people actually do that?

-People do that.



0874 01:00:47:11 01:00:50:21

So, clean up the house

and make a cup of tea or coffee.



0875 01:00:50:24 01:00:56:06

And add pictures like Claudio did. And let 

us feel that you really want to do that.



0876 01:00:56:09 01:00:59:14

Not that you're on social benefits

and you say:



0877 01:00:59:17 01:01:03:04

'There was nothing else I could do,

so let's start up a business.'



0878 01:01:03:07 01:01:07:09

We have to feel that you fit 

the business that you want to have.



0879 01:01:07:12 01:01:10:24

So, that's actually 

the main advice I can give.



0880 01:01:11:02 01:01:13:18

Be yourself.

-That's a good tip.



0881 01:01:13:21 01:01:16:09

Do you have anything to add to that?



0882 01:01:16:12 01:01:23:02

At crowdfunding the presentation is online

and you present to investors.



0883 01:01:23:05 01:01:28:17

So, an investor decides in five minutes

if they're going to invest or not.



0884 01:01:28:20 01:01:31:15

The story has to be very clear and simple.



0885 01:01:31:18 01:01:36:11

If you have a very difficult

or complex product



0886 01:01:36:14 01:01:40:06

then make a video, add some pictures.



0887 01:01:40:09 01:01:46:23

In that way an investor can easily and 

quickly decide whether they want to invest.



0888 01:01:47:01 01:01:53:10

Is it about the entrepreneur's likeability?

-Yes, it's very much about the likeability.



0889 01:01:55:11 01:01:58:20

Investors at crowdfunding



0890 01:01:58:23 01:02:03:10

are about profit and are about



0891 01:02:03:13 01:02:09:08

the returns on their investments

but also: is it a nice entrepreneur?



0892 01:02:09:11 01:02:13:00

What's the background,

what's the motivation behind it?



0893 01:02:13:03 01:02:20:06

And, eventually, do I have a good feeling 

with the guy I'm going to invest in, or girl?



0894 01:02:20:09 01:02:23:01

And you get goodies as well, 

right, when you...



0895 01:02:23:04 01:02:27:07

Yeah, we do advise to use incentives



0896 01:02:27:10 01:02:32:07

like a discount 

or a part of the product



0897 01:02:32:10 01:02:35:02

you're willing to offer to your investor.



0898 01:02:35:05 01:02:40:07

Netherlands Chamber of Commerce has

also lined up practical tips for pitching.



0899 01:02:40:10 01:02:44:23

Personalize your presentation, 

every investor is different.



0900 01:02:45:01 01:02:50:14

Explain why you want to start your business.

What's your passion?



0901 01:02:50:17 01:02:53:05

Stick to the essence of your story.



0902 01:02:53:08 01:02:58:16

Practice your pitch with friends or

acquaintances and/or in front of the mirror.



0903 01:02:58:19 01:03:02:12

Keep it short and simple.



0904 01:03:05:13 01:03:11:17

Gertjan, in what way does a digital 

presentation differ from one in person?



0905 01:03:11:20 01:03:19:06

A digital presentation, you can't discuss

or get a reply to your investors.



0906 01:03:19:09 01:03:23:23

So, the story has to be very clear,

very simple, like you just said.



0907 01:03:24:01 01:03:27:17

But also must not raise any questions.



0908 01:03:27:20 01:03:31:24

What makes your bike unique?

-What makes my bike unique?



0909 01:03:32:02 01:03:38:06

My bike is unique because it's 

the biggest bike on the market.



0910 01:03:38:09 01:03:41:01

The biggest pizza bike on the market.



0911 01:03:41:04 01:03:47:09

You can find bike 

capable to bake 200 pizza.



0912 01:03:47:12 01:03:52:00

Only getting your bike, cycling around, 

stop on the spot.



0913 01:03:52:03 01:03:55:14

Put up your structure 

and then you can bake 200 pizzas.



0914 01:03:55:17 01:04:00:24

The structure is a tent as well?

-Yeah, it's a handcraft tent.



0915 01:04:01:02 01:04:05:15

All the system, 

I have built it on my own.



0916 01:04:05:18 01:04:10:01

Wow.

-The only help I got for the structure



0917 01:04:10:04 01:04:13:06

was from a welder



0918 01:04:13:09 01:04:16:05

and from my father. 

-Very good. That sounds unique.



0919 01:04:16:08 01:04:19:21

Roy, when entrepreneurs 

present their plans at Qredits



0920 01:04:19:24 01:04:25:14

which is most important? Is it the numbers, 

the story or the entrepreneurs themselves?



0921 01:04:25:17 01:04:31:00

When we have the plan and we've read it, 

we want to know who's the entrepreneur.



0922 01:04:31:03 01:04:34:17

Who's the man or woman behind the plan.

So, the entrepreneur comes first.



0923 01:04:34:20 01:04:39:19

We get curious because we want to know 

who's the man with a plan for a pizza bike.



0924 01:04:39:22 01:04:43:02

A fietseria.

That's the most important thing.



0925 01:04:43:05 01:04:46:15

So, the story and to know the story

we have to meet Claudio.



0926 01:04:46:18 01:04:50:09

Or we make a video call, 

that's also very common.



0927 01:04:50:12 01:04:53:17

To speak people on a WhatsApp.



0928 01:04:53:20 01:04:59:07

And then the numbers. You talk about the 

numbers, you talk about the financial plan.



0929 01:04:59:10 01:05:05:01

I really would recommend to also 

put some effort in the financial plan.



0930 01:05:05:04 01:05:09:06

Because we see a lot of people

telling a lot about the story



0931 01:05:09:09 01:05:12:22

but they don't have the skills

to write a financial plan.



0932 01:05:13:00 01:05:18:09

And how do you actually find out

who you can work with or not, Gertjan?



0933 01:05:18:12 01:05:21:11

Well, a good entrepreneur 

knows what he's talking about.



0934 01:05:21:14 01:05:27:03

He knows his market, he knows his

branch, his bike. He knows everything.



0935 01:05:27:06 01:05:33:03

It really comes with passion 

and convincement in their story



0936 01:05:33:06 01:05:35:09

and their business plan.



0937 01:05:35:12 01:05:39:10

What if you're not so good at pitching?

What then?



0938 01:05:39:13 01:05:43:20

At Geldvoorelkaar 

we help the entrepreneur



0939 01:05:43:23 01:05:46:20

to get a good pitch for the investors.



0940 01:05:46:23 01:05:53:11

So, videos, pictures

and a really nice presentation.



0941 01:05:53:14 01:06:00:11

But I think it's not a very difficult way



0942 01:06:00:14 01:06:05:22

to get some help 

if you're not really that good in it.



0943 01:06:06:00 01:06:08:24

Do you agree?

-Yes, it's not the main thing.



0944 01:06:09:02 01:06:13:15

What we want to do, is to meet

Claudio in his own environment.



0945 01:06:13:18 01:06:19:09

If he's a good pizza baker, and if he has 

the right skills like hospitality to sell them.



0946 01:06:19:12 01:06:23:05

And pitching is... I think for crowdfunding

it's more important than for us.



0947 01:06:23:08 01:06:27:08

But I think you also help people with

writing a pitch, that's not a problem.



0948 01:06:27:11 01:06:29:06

Let's be honest, for a bricklayer



0949 01:06:29:09 01:06:32:00

it's not the most important thing

to have a good pitch.



0950 01:06:32:03 01:06:37:14

If you are a consultant, we look at how you

pitch yourself, but that's another thing.



0951 01:06:37:17 01:06:42:01

Just a small part of the market, 

it's very important to have a good pitch.



0952 01:06:42:04 01:06:44:24

You give tips for that as well?

-Exactly.



0953 01:06:45:02 01:06:49:16

Do you want to know from entrepreneurs who

want to start a business in the Netherlands



0954 01:06:49:19 01:06:51:10

why they want to do it here?



0955 01:06:51:13 01:06:53:19

Yes, we will always ask them.



0956 01:06:53:22 01:06:58:02

We want to know why they're here, do 

they have relatives or family over here?



0957 01:06:58:05 01:07:00:06

What's the reason they come over here?



0958 01:07:00:09 01:07:05:03

Because we also want to know, what's 

the risk that they go back with a loan?



0959 01:07:05:06 01:07:09:04

We ask these questions and we

want to have straight answers.



0960 01:07:09:07 01:07:13:20

Did you practice your presentation, 

Claudio? And how did you do it?



0961 01:07:13:23 01:07:18:02

Yeah, I practiced my presentation



0962 01:07:18:05 01:07:23:02

but only on the numbers side

of my business plan.



0963 01:07:23:05 01:07:26:13

Because for the rest, 

it was quite natural for me.



0964 01:07:26:16 01:07:31:17

Because I built up 

from the first screw my bike.



0965 01:07:31:20 01:07:39:01

I'm a pizza lover. Pizza is something 

in my blood. You can say it like that.



0966 01:07:39:04 01:07:41:24

So that part wasn't difficult for you.

-No.



0967 01:07:42:02 01:07:47:15

What would have done if you hadn't 

succeeded? Did you have a plan B or C?



0968 01:07:47:18 01:07:53:12

Yes, my plan B was just 

to go back to my old job.



0969 01:07:53:15 01:07:58:06

Start to do a pizza again, 

and pay back my debts.



0970 01:07:58:09 01:08:01:05

That was my B plan.



0971 01:08:01:08 01:08:04:08

Sounds like a good plan B.

-It is.



0972 01:08:04:11 01:08:09:17

Thank you so much for being here and

sharing your expertise and experiences.



0973 01:08:09:20 01:08:11:24

You're welcome.



0974 01:08:12:02 01:08:15:01

We've come to the end of this webinar.

Thank you for watching.



0975 01:08:15:04 01:08:20:06

For more information 

please visit business.gov.nl.